So what do you do?

By aemetha · Aug 8, 2016 · ·
  1. aemetha
    What do you do when your doctor tells you there's nothing left to try?

    Truth is there are many things left to try. Ketamine, Modafinil, Amphetamines, Gabapentin, Opioids, microdosing LSD. All of these have anecdotal and in some case double blind studies showing successful treatment of anxiety and/or treatment resistant depression. The fact that they are so afraid to do anything that is slightly unusual is very frustrating. I'm not asking for recreational doses, I just want a therapeutic dose of things that haven't been tried yet. I've been through every standard treatment, the non-standard ones are being denied me.

    So today, I stop taking all of my prescribed psychoactive drugs. They aren't helping me, I'm in the same place I have been for months now. Maybe not taking them will help me.

    I'm still going to use poppy seed tea, it helps with both depression and anxiety more than anything else I've ever had. I don't plan to use it all the time though, I will use it on the days things are really tough. I don't ever plan to increase my dose, I've successfully detoxed off it a couple of times, and I plan to do that periodically if my tolerance rises to the point where it starts becoming ineffective.

    I'm still going to use cannabis for insomnia. Again, it just works better than anything else I've tried.

    I never sought illicit drugs really. I tried every legal avenue first. The truth everyone likes to dance around is that illicit drugs work better than the legal ones. They are more dangerous and carry more of a risk of addiction in some cases, but they do work.

    I'm going to keep trying to get better, I really don't know where to turn next though. Where is the harm in trying things? Especially when there are proven records of efficacy. Maybe I should source these things illicitly and test the effectiveness. Might need to put a test kit on my shopping list.

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  1. leo nard
    just be careful man and educate yourself (even from anecdotal evidence on the net) as much as possible.

    other than that, i cannot deny that i see your point/your frustration.

    selfmedication is a risky thing but i trust you're clever enough to give it a good shot.
    (you already mention mj and occasionaly PST, you know those two are automatically make me like you :p ;) )

    best of luck mate!
  2. fleur du mal
    I think you've opened up a good avenue for discussion here, aemetha. I know how frustrated you are by the fact that "conventional" treatments aren't working very well, and I share that frustration. The anti-depressant I'm on only takes the slightest edge off of my depression, and benzos just make me sleep (which means I basically can't function on them). So, I use the tea.

    I think people really need to have a frank discussion about mental illness and opiates, but this doesn't happen because of the taboo surrounding opiate addiction. It's a really modern phenomenon to treat opiate addiction this way. A hundred years ago, opiate addiction was very common in the US. The way I see it, there are two ways to approach the issue. We can talk about opiate addiction from an impartial standpoint, or we can continue to demonize it and perpetuate a stigma which only facilitates self-destructive use.

    The first approach requires us to admit that opiate addiction isn't always the *worst* thing in the world, and that's why it isn't popular. There are many psychiatric medications which are just as addictive and whose withdrawal is more dangerous. I've personally had terrible withdrawal from an SSRI I was on for several years.

    I think that marginalizing the use of opiates for mental health disorders actually creates a more destructive environment for addicts, because there's no standard of moderate, functional use. Not many people know this, but when opium smoking was popular in China, moderate use was the norm, and most people who smoked were not incapacitated by it.

    Modern medicine really removes the sense of agency for patients, in my opinion. We're expected to go along with this assumption that the doctor always knows what's best and that we don't have the ultimate right to make decisions about our own health and well-being. I wish you weren't going off your medications, but I get why you're doing it. I also wish you weren't flirting with opium addiction, but, again, I get why you're doing it. I know that you're very well-informed about the risks and the downsides, much more so than the average patient who just gulps down whatever pill the doctor hands them. Ultimately, it's your right to decide what's best for your health, and you know I'll be here for you whatever path you decide to take. :vibes:
  3. afriendoftina
    I agree, I personally prescribe myself Ketamine for medical reasons of my psychotic depression. Though the psychosis has largely dissipated since I took those anti-psychotics and cut back on Tina.

    Ketamine would never be prescribed as an anti-depressant by a doctor in the UK but for me - it is the perfect anti-depressant that has be gleeful for a whole week following a k-hole. This is just my experience of my Ketamine use for depression. Obviously, Ketamine comes with dangerous side effects but for me it's better than going down the depression path or the SSRI path (which was hell)

    Good luck mate, whatever you choose.
  4. aemetha
    Thanks for your support guys. I am going to be careful with anything I try, like I said I don't even want recreational doses, just therapeutic ones. I'm trying St Johns Wort and Valerian at the moment first anyway. I've been using them for the last few days and I don't feel any worse for having been off the prescribed meds and on the herbals so that's a positive sign. More importantly I haven't had any side effects from the St Johns Wort that I had with the other serotonergic medications I tried previously yet and I'm taking a fairly large dose (4g/day) so I think that bodes well. With the prescribed ones I noticed side effects pretty early into a large dose regime.
  5. afriendoftina
    Chin up. Fighting depression is a very, very hard thing to do, most will try several before it works. We are all human but react individualistically to anti-depressants. When you find your "anti-depressant soulmate" then you will be AMAZING.

    Take care, always around for a meth/ketamine/mephedrone/sex/ghb/gbl/antiemetics chat -you know where to find me
  6. Mr Bumble
    So many addicts suffered depression and sought relearn in drugs. Poppy seed tea is no different from me shooting morphine, same drug and it's ruined my life and bought me to the brink of madness, prison, locked wards and police cells, court again on the 30th.

    Just be careful dude
  7. aemetha
    So I figured it was time to update this thread.

    My current regimen seems to be working, much better in fact than anything that was previously prescribed. I wouldn't describe myself as happy, but I'm not miserable.

    I'm currently taking:

    St Johns Wort 4g/day for depression symptoms.
    Propranolol 40mg/day for anxiety symtoms.
    Gabapentin 900mg/day for restless legs syndrome.
    Pramipexole 0.25mg/day for restless legs syndrome.
    Melatonin 1.5mg/day for insomnia.

    I am using the poppy seed tea infrequently (less than once a week), for an unexpected reason. Even with the restless legs and insomnia meds I sleep most days for only around four hours, and even those four hours aren't particularly good sleep. When I use the poppy seed tea, that night I sleep for at least six hours and it is very refreshing sleep. Right now I am able to use it very infrequently when I really need to recover from the poor sleep. I have no intention of increasing the frequency of use of it, and it's at this time not at all recreational use.

    I am hoping to get some tweaking done of my meds at my next doctors appointments, specifically I want to get my gabapentin increased slightly so I don't require the pramipexole at all. Gabapentin is more suitable for long term use because pramipexole will worsen the condition in the long term. Gabapentin is also sedating and anxiolytic which is obviously of benefit to my insomnia and anxiety respectively.

    Anyway, things are looking more positive right now.
  8. detoxin momma
    hey Aemetha, do you drink plenty of water?? my husband has that RLS, he used to take that mirapex to, when he came off it, the doctor lectured him on how much hydration plays a role in RLS. when he goes out of his way to drink water over other things, he barely has the RLS.When he doesn't, those legs don't sit still at night.
    I'm a light sleeper, so i can really see the difference.

    I started taking the St.Johns wort mood support to, i really like that stuff. i've herad people recommend that for years but never listened, glad i finally tried it, i can see myself taking this long term.

    I'm aware you are bipolar to, we don't "need" much sleep, but that doesn't mean we don't WANT sleep either, thats how i feel anyways.
    the OTC sleep aids, for whatever reason, just make me have to keep getting up to pee! so no thanks on that. recently i started taking valerian root, i like the herbal approaches because they are not only cheaper, but just as effective, and dont have the dreadful side effects.

    i was shocked a bottle of 100 capsules cost less than a pack of a cigs!
    so, could be a worth a try for you. I pop 2 an hour before bedtime, and its like taking a benzo, only no risk of addiction , and i don't have to pay someone to give them to me :)
  9. aemetha
    I have valerian root extract here, and I have tried it. Unfortunately I appear to be one of those for whom valerian worsens instead of relieves RLS. I do drink quite a bit of water, and zero sugar sports drinks occasionally too to stay hydrated and yeah it does definitely help.

    The opiates is by far the best thing for my RLS, which is consistent with the literature on it. I wish I knew why though. Opiates are not ideal to treat it for obvious reasons with tolerance and dependence, but it's not just the dopamine response, if that were the case I should feel the same level of relief when I take my dopamine agonists, but I don't. At this point I kind of feel as though there must be some link between opioids and restless legs that's not fully explained by dopamine alone. I'm managing for now with the current regimen though and I'm not going to go playing around with daily dosing on opiates when I can get by without that.
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