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I have tried a few Synthetics, but this one seems much stronger. I consider myself fairly seasoned with smoking drugs, but this one has messed me up a couple of times. In small doses, it gives a fairly intense buzz, superclear visuals, pretty heady. Half of a small cone will be enough. One cone, you are going to feel it strong, it comes on pretty quickly. Two cones... game over, and not in a nice way.
It gives you a real feeling of doom, and makes you anxious. I have let it get this far twice, and found myself reassuring myself "You are fine, just ride it out", and basically not being able to do anything but move around the house waiting for it to wear off. I have smoked weed for 15+ years, and never felt like that, so I don't consider myself a sensitive individual or prone to anxiety. It is a tricky one, and I can see how some young people might get themselves in to trouble using this in the same quantities as weed.. it is a different drug, follow my measures and don't push it.
P.S my cones are like the size of the smallest sockets in a socket set.
sgt-7 and sgt-19 have been implicated in acute kidney failure.. adb-pinaca has put its share of people on life support recently
adb-pinaca was identified in a specific blend associated with poisonings but the possibility of impurities or other chemicals in that blend being more responsible for the poisonings still exists - if this possibility has been explored please would be interested in details. Thanks
#1 The way I see it is, there is no way to rule out the possibility that adb-pinaca is a a toxin.
I am not in court, nor am I ghost hunting So the " innocent until proven guilty" and " disproving the claim or allegations" are not on my agenda. There are are 20+ noids in this wave that are nor allegedly putting people in the hospital, There is no point whatsoever in thinking it is safe.
#2 The product sold under that name on atleast 2 vendors, a long with any traces of selling it. Were removed prior to or shortly after the GBI's press release.
Nobody has picked it up since.. I know it was made schedule 1 based on the interpretation of the analog law when it was found. The USA isn't the onlyplace this stuff is sold.
Its toxic until proven otherwise. There have been millions of packets of spice sold in the last couple years and impurities have come and gone without putting 200 or more people in the hospital (in atleast 2 states) over a weeks time..
Thanks for your reply! I agree that adb-pinaca, sgt-7, sgt-19, and others may eventually prove to have atypical acute toxic effects: kidney failure, coma, inability to breath without ventilator, foaming at the mouth, paralysis in mid-motion, unresponsiveness of vital processes, manic aggressive psychosis, or other negative effects besides those listed above as described in the recent Colorado and Georgia poisonings threads here or by the NZ government. The warnings posted on this forum are entirely appropriate since these atypical effects are definitely connected to a few blends which were found to contain cannabinoids, and I hope such warnings continue.
However while these following caveats are far from proving the cannabinoids being discussed are not responsible for the atypical symptoms, it still is I think worth noting that
1]The symptoms above don't fit the established profile for the vast majority of cannabinoid overdose/poisonings [ which do seem to follow a general pattern across a wide spectrum of dozens of cannabinoids of various chemical classes and which include seizures, panic reactions, tachycardia, and feelings of prostration and being poisoned]
2]None of the atypical poisonings are reported to be from pure powders but all from blends by definition containing a variety of ingredients
3]Each set of reported poisonings has been associated with a single blend or manufacturer in a limited geographic area and a limited time period
4]Chemical analysis for those chemicals responsible for the poisonings is quite possibly satisfied once an association with any cannabinoids is found, since this satisfies the agendas of the public agencies involved, and it is questionable how closely other possibilities are being considered. [But one of the analysts in either the GA or CO threads here specifically speculated contaminants were involved I believe].
To sum up I greatly appreciate the warnings here; I'd like as much more information as possible regarding the 20+ noids you refer to as being associated with more severe toxic symptoms than those generally accepted; but I do think the association of these cannabinoids with all the toxicities described is still weak enough that they shouldn't be considered firmly established. I am very open to and interested in information establishing such associations more firmly, or in contradicting them. Thanks
Back on topic.. this cannabinoid would probably be the only one id try. Based on safety assesment in nz, which in all actuality isn't much at all to base an opinion on. Considering that they are profiling blends with the same ratios of 5fpb22 and calling some safe and some not.. (they should really look into that)
Also the alleged potentcy is an upside for me... not because I want to get more high, but because I will be inhaling a lower volume of mystery smoke.
The new law means psychoactive products can only be sold if they pose no more than a low risk of harm to people using them. There are restrictions on where and how they can be sold, and they can only be sold to people 18 years and over.
This has resulted in an estimated 75% reduction in the number of psychoactive products on the market and an estimated 95% reduction in the number of outlets selling psychoactive products since legislation came into force on 18 July 2013.
The remaining products and retail outlets are now subject to active and on-going scrutiny and testing by health professionals and police.
How does the Psychoactive Substances Act work?
The new legislation places responsibility on manufacturers to demonstrate there is low risk of harm in any psychoactive substances or products they propose to sell.
Currently an interim regime is in place while the regulations are developed that will detail exactly how this system will work. There will be consultation on the regulations.
How does the Regulatory Authority measure ‘low risk of harm’?
To obtain an interim retail or wholesale licence, a person must have applied for a licence by 14 August - within 28 days of the Act commencing, and:
be a New Zealand resident
be a fit and proper person (or a company of good repute)
have traded in psychoactive products for at least 28 days prior to the Act commencing
Dairies, convenience and grocery stores, service stations, and liquor outlets are all specifically banned from selling psychoactive substances.
To obtain an interim product approval, the product owner or manufacturer must have applied for an approval by 14 August - within 28 days of the Act commencing, with details of the product, including that it has been on the market for at least three months.
The full extent of restrictions and requirements related to the sale of products will be available when regulations come into effect in 2014.
Will harmful products continue to be banned once the new regulations are in place?
Once the new regulations come into effect banned products will continue to be banned because the evidence gathered to date shows they have significant adverse effects on the health of people using them.
It will be up to a manufacturer to provide conclusive evidence a product has a low risk of harm for it to be approved and available for sale in New Zealand.
Is online trading of any products banned?
It is legal for psychoactive products that have interim approval to be sold on the internet by licensed retailers providing they meet advertising and labelling requirements set out in the Act, and are not sold to people under 18 years of age.
It is illegal to sell unapproved psychoactive products on the internet and this is in line with wider drug legislation in New Zealand.
What if new information comes in showing a product causes harm?
The Psychoactive Substances Regulatory Authority has the power to recall any interim approved product if it considers the product poses more than a low risk of harm to individuals using it.
How can people find out what products are approved?
A list of interim approved products and interim licensed retailers is availabe on this website. (chose not break 50 rules and did not upload this. info is at the NZ minishtry of health web page)
How is the law being enforced?
Enforcement and monitoring is carried out by police and district health board public health officers. New enforcement officers are being appointed by the Regulatory Authority.
Customs has lead responsibility for ensuring unapproved psychoactive substances do not enter New Zealand.
The community also plays a vital role and police would like to hear from anyone who knows of party pills or synthetic cannabinoids being sold from dairies, convenience and grocery stores and other prohibited premises, or from any premises to anyone under the age of 18 years.
My opinion is while this constitutes a noble step in the right direction its also rides a thin line of failure. They based it off of safety information that does not exist, and gives too much rope to the vendors.
Placing the burden of truth, and health of citizens on RC vendors baffles me. Hell, This law just came in effect and already the formulas are changing frequently. Although the vendors do have to list the actual ingredients, which would be a great thing if they were trustworthy.
They are also playing the name game already. several examples of this would be illustrated by the SGT-xxx series of noids. These noids do not have any solid relation to an IUPAC officially.. at least not from a users perspective. examples are LDD/3 <-- wtf is that? I have also seen 5f-adb-pinaca and ADB-Fupinaca at times share the same IUPAC and at other times they differ.. its weird
anyway the main upside are the risk assesments on each product. It is the only real safety info available. Even though you have resign yourself to taking the vendors word that the actives and mix are accurate.
At the moment the regulations are not based on real info, that why there are only intermediate approvals. In order to establish the framework of the law you need historical data and trustworthy vendors who are willing to do the legwork and study / publish solid safety data.. seems far fetched considering the vendors are still using ambiguous. Street names
It reminds me of the reaction oriented policy of the fda's sports supplement regulation. Where the rules don't appear to regulate products until they hurt somebody. If you can find a natural source for any random chemical its cool to sell it. Hell driven sports has recently proven that a good lie about a natural source is fine.. and they didn't even report the highly illegal active.. it took two years to take it off the market.
Anyway, every single cannabinoid ever made has potential to cause harm if taken irresponsibly. So eventually this law could lead to highly comprehensive and wide spread bans on cannabinoids, without the headache of analog laws..
Hi guys. The whole problem is, we have archaic laws regarding cannabis in New Zealand, and no one would bother with synthetics if it was decriminalized or legalized. Until that day though, some of us want to get high without having to deal with the usual types who sell weed over here. Also, the average "tinny" or foil is supposed to be a little over a gram, but most people will rip you off because they know you don't have many options. With the synthetics, you get 2.5 grams guaranteed, and it will last you a while because you don't need to burn as much. I have switched from the SGT-24 to CL-2201 for a more mellow experience, as I like to have a buzz going while I work.
If you want an intense high, and like pushing the envelope a bit SGT-24 is the way to go.. I don't know anything about the chemistry of these things, I google them to see if they have given adverse side effects, that is about it.
If I could just smoke Ganja legally, or at least had a reliable source that is all I would have.
I don't feel the synthetics have the same effect as weed, I always feel they are missing something, but maybe have too much of another trait.
I literally was about to check out a few new compouds (5F-PB22 is good by my standards, I could see how maybe if your prone to headaches it would exacerbate that, and I also noticed slipping in and out of consciousness, not in a sleepy or im not breathing away, but in away that if all was quiet - for 1:20 mins then all of a sudden my roommates door opens - like a rush of epinephrine/norepinephrine that subsides within seconds that fight or flight wtfissthat-lets get the fuck out-ohwait no its all good-relaxed LOL feeling) - only to realize you'd been high, enjoying yourself, living in between now without future nor past only nothing profound like universal-mind-meld psychedlics, and it feels like 5 minutes has gone by but you look and the movie you were attempting to watch is over (for who knows how long) only to have been brough back to this reality tunnel by that sound of an old door opening. Strangest feeling. This happens mostly when vaporizing it versus burning blends (unless you toke bowl after bowl). I mixed some BB-22 with it aswell. CB reuptake/FAAH inhibitor/peripheral cannabinoid-receptor agonist abilities stretch and change the high when mixed with a striaght cb1/cb2 agonist