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Opiate addiction Support for coping with Opiate addiction and Opiate addiction treatment.

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Old 10-01-2010, 06:34
magister magister is offline
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Kratom Addiction with Suboxone

SWIM didn't know where else to post this. Perhaps because Kratom is legal no body thinks you can get addicted. SWIM has heard that some users of other opiates have tried to kick the habit by switching to Kratom, so perhaps there are some in this forum who know about this. Point is that although SWIM has done other opiods like codeine, poppy tea, methadone and heroin, these were mostly just isolated episodes, however it did develop a taste for this class of substances. However the other classes, mostly weed kept SWIM occupied. However when SWIM got busted and narrowly escaped jail, SWIM decided to look for legal things. At first the most available legal thing was alcohol, and this was a problem for awhile, however the hang-over was so terrible, that GHB (before illegalised in '03?), phenibut, and finally Kratom were much better substances for SWIM to use. SWIM could relax at the end of the day, sleep well, and wake up without a hang over.

SWIM had a pretty stressful job and started getting back pains which kept him using Kratom. This kept up for 3 years, occasionally running out SWIM would get anxiety, and drink alcohol to make up for it. At this point the Kratom was only in the evenings, once a day. Withdrawals were managable, but were still no fun. Then about a year ago, SWIM lost his job, then SWIM was around the house and started doing Kratom upon waking, soon it was a 3-4 times a day habit. Some days SWIM would take Kratom all day just chasing the ideal high. Now when SWIM runs low the anxiety and withdrawal symptoms are worse. They start about about 6 hours but don't get intense until about 12. Kratom seems to half a fast high-life.

SWIM wants to be free of this, but the withdrawals are too scary now, last time SWIM ran out was a few months ago. SWIM guzzled hard booze and took Iboprophen/codeine (12.8mg) Nurophen tablets. Actually he thinks he came close to alcohol poisoning and the amount of Iboprophen from the tablets was not health. SWIM went 48 hours and finally the parcel with the Kratom arrived. SWIM had to order as he had not option as the withdrawals decended upon him. SWIM started taking the Kratom but was still dealing with the poisoning of the alcohol. SWIM didn't know what to do, the feelings were too intense, SWIM doesn't think he can cope with the withdrawals, he is worried he will turn to whatever he can and drink himself to death. SWIM hates alcohol, it is just the only thing he could get.

SWIM wants to get off Kratom, he has recently read about Suboxone. SWIM is hoping this will help him. First off he will not have to worry about parcels arriving in the post, he will be able to travel and visit relatives without having to eye out holiday sized bags of Kratom leaf which he hope customs does not mistake for something illegal...Some of SWIM's relatives are in Isreal where they totally search all your bags. To be caught overseas with your relatives who don't know about your addiction and the border patrol to seize your Kratom would be a nightmare SWIM thinks, so SWIM doesn't travel, and hasn't seen any relatives since SWIM's addiction got more severe 18 months ago.

With Suboxone, SWIM would have a prescription and could live life again. The only thing is SWIM is not sure he can get Suboxone from the outpatient self-referral clinic he plans to see. He doesn't want to talk to his doctor as then the matter would be on his Health computer file. But there is a confidental outreach centre nearby, SWIM is not sure they will give Suboxone to a Kratom user, since Kratom is not a scheduled substance. so SWIM has to be careful, in some ways it would be easier if SWIM was addicted to a standard opiod pill because then the medical establishment would know how to treat it, but SWIM has read about the receptor chemistry and believes that Suboxone will also be effective for KRatom addiction, there is no support for Kratom addicts because no one wants to hear about it, they just want Kratom to stay legal, and SWIM agrees but SWIM knows there is another side to the story that is not discussed on the forums.

Anyhow SWIM will phone the centre confidentially and ask about Kratom and Suboxone, if the person answering says they don't know it, sorry no Suboxone for Kratom, it has to be illegal, then SWIM will go into the centre and just say he has been getting codeine from cold water extraction and has got addicted to it.

Any thoughts, advice, comments, please share them....thanks for reading...magister

magister added 20 Minutes and 41 Seconds later...

SWIM would also like to add that beside the Subuxone that SWIM is considering asking for a couple other things. One of the main reasons SWIM takes substances is that SWIM finds it hard to wind down at the end of the day and get in bed and go to sleep. SWIM is restless and starts thinking lots of thoughts which keeps SWIM from sleeping. So SWIM would like to ask for something to help him sleep. Also SWIM has been noticing how depressed he is since this addiction started, it first hit him when he experienced withdrawals, how boring and dull life is, but then even when he had plenty of Kratom SWIM feels bored with life and generally stuck in life without meaning. SWIM has read about various anti-depressants and thinks that Bupropion (wellbutrin) to be the best and could even help with his tobacco habit.

Is it reasonable to ask for a sleeping tablet and antidepressants when kicking a drug addiction? Anyone on this forum have experience with this. I think that sleeping tablets
do get prescribed as I read a thread of a SWIM who got Zopiclone, however SWIM is not sure about the antidepressants. SWIM knows that he wants to be completely drug free but feels he is stuck and not motivated, if he had a more positive outlook he could get up and start living and then could do excercise and get off all of the pills.

Last edited by magister; 10-01-2010 at 06:34. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Old 10-01-2010, 06:47
ex-junkie ex-junkie is offline
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Re: Kratom Addiction with Suboxone

i think there is no need for sleeping tablets, when you can just take drowsy antihistamines which have always been more effective for a FULL nights sleep for swim. swim used to abuse sleeping tablets, and they only worked for about 4 hours of sleep at a time, which just made her take more than prescribed.

its perfectly okay to ask for antidepressants and sleeping tablets when coming off of drugs. in fact, thats the smart way to do it. just be careful because antidepressants can make things worse in swims experience, they are useful for short term, but can be quite harmful in the long term if you take drugs whilst on them.

without using drugs on top, swims had good results from antidepressants for 2-6 months, then has noticed she doesnt need them anymore, or have made her worse.

in those situations stopping them abruptly (which isnt recommended btw), actually made her come good.

be safe.
Old 10-01-2010, 14:25
magister magister is offline
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Re: Kratom Addiction with Suboxone

SWIM thanks ex-junkie for the advice and confirms SWIM has no intention of doing other drugs while on anti-depressants, in fact he is reminded of his first high school experiences with LSD, back then a friend of SWIM was prescribed and taking Lithium. None of SWIMs crowd of friends knew this guy was taking Lithium but they continued to take LSD and for 4-6 weeks it was every weekend with larger dosages, as well as other psychedelics like shrooms. SWIM saw this friend slowly lose his mind, whatever than means, just that the spirit and animation left, and a dour expressionless glum set in.

As for drowsy histamines, does ex-junkie mean Promethazine? SWIM realises sleeping tablets might be addictive as anything that has helped him sleep usually worked by reducing anxiety....in fact SWIM feels he has slept so much during the last 18 months of Kratom addiction that is tired of living in the dream world and experiencing such boredom in waking life. in fact SWIM attempted to reduce Kratom in december buy taking speed, although it did work, when the speed ran out, it would always lead SWIM back to Kratom, in fact SWIM recalls it was initially the use of speed and E's at all night raves that developed SWIM's craving for pills that would cushion the come down.

Any other SWIM's who have had trouble with Kratom addiction? I know, wikipedia says
"Kratom is mildly addictive and withdrawal is possible after frequent heavy use. While rarely severe or disabling, withdrawal symptoms can include depression, fatigue, restlessness, teary eyes, and insomnia. It is comparable to morphine withdrawal in character and caffeine withdrawal in severity."

but probably due to SWIMs excessive use it seems a bit more sever than caffeine.
Old 11-01-2012, 13:01
smegmachilles smegmachilles is offline
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Re: Kratom Addiction with Suboxone

SWIM saw a news report about the dangers of kratom and in it, a doctor prescribed Suboxone for a patient. To SWIM this sounded like telling someone to use chewing tobacco in order to break a chewing gum habit. In any case, SWIM googled this practice and found this post. SWIM has read a fair amount of information about kratom since he started taking it a little over a year ago and has never read an account of such severe problems with kratom as SWIY has had. SWIM is wondering if Suboxone worked for SWIY and if SWIY feels as though the experience of kratom withdrawal was due to physical dependence or if it was a psychological dependence. SWIM hopes SWIY feels much better now and would love to hear about how things turned out.

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