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I know that in europe they have looked into using g for the treatment of certain addictions more than they have in the u.s. I was wondering if anyone ever heard of any research using g for the treatment of opiate addiction/withdrawal. I know that g can be physically and mentally addictive on it's own, but when used intelligently can be very helpful for the treatment of alcoholism. I read that they thought that g might work directly on opiate receptors but then decided that it didn't but that it's metabolites might. Basically I just want to know if anyone has ever used g to kick a heavy opiate habit like herion for example. And when I say g I mean ghb,gbl,bd or any other analogue.
It would make sense that anything that could mask the horrible withdrawl symptoms from opiates would work. From a neurological standpoint I've never heard of opiate receptors having an affinity for G or its metabolites but it has been 2 yrs since swim did any research on the subject. It would probably be best used in the way that suboxone is prescribed by taking at the onset of sickness.
BE CAREFUL! GBL has a unique and different "rebound" "withdrawl" whatever then GHB. SWIM used GBL for light opiate withdrawl, by the 5th day SWIM was over the withdrawl but had not slept in 2 days from the increasing GBL rebound!
SWIM had no benzos and had to settle for a friend's Elavil to finally break the reliance on GBL for sleep yuck! For days afterward SWIM was hyper as hell and had trouble sleeping.
GBL has a nasty withdrawl and will rob you of the ability to sleep without using ever increasing amounts, there have been many reports of this. Medical professionals will not be able to help, they will put you in a psych ward and wait for you to "come down" before giving you anything. This can be 3-10 days of delirium tremens. Keep this in mind, and keep something like benzos or phenibut on hand because going to the ER when you've been up for 5 days and are hallucinating will not bring relief.
SWIM used heroin daily for 2 years, but at the time knew nothing about GHB but now wishes she had. SWIM became a regular GHB user in 2001 and was a heavy daily user for about 6 months.
Comparing the withdrawals is like comparing panadol and morphine.
For SWIM Heroin withdrawals were hell on earth, and if there was even a slight chance that taking another substance could lessen the degree of torment then SWIM would have done it in a second, no questions asked!
For SWIM GHB withdrawal was a piece of cake. Unless there was heavy use for more than a couple of weeks then no withdrawal symptoms were noticed. With prolonged use withdrawal lasted a day which SWIM spent mostly sleeping (without any trouble). Apart from being tired SWIM also had anxiety and felt a bit shakey but these were very subtle symptoms and over all it was easier than having the flu.
I have read the GHB crosses the blood brain barrier like opiates do so it would be fair to say that it would give some relief to one going through heroin withdrawal. And in theory, the pleasurable effects of GHB would certainly counteract or disguise some of the symptoms of withdrawal from any drug.
SWIM wouldn't recommend trying synthetic substances to get off others...
SWIM has always a natural answer to every problem.
SWIM think GHB would definately help for sleeping but what would really help with the craving there would be to take an Ibogaine containing plant. This combined with some cannabis or good doses of kava and valerian would fill in the hole. You have to be sure to have a good source of ionic magnesium and colloidal gold would help too in rebalancing the hormonal system.
SWIM seconds the motion on the tramadol. It can help through the rough WD times and most Dr.'s don't consider it a strong enough drug to limit it like they do opiates. SWIM has no trouble getting them from a Doc who thinks darvocet is should be administered in quantities of 7 pills for the entire month. He flat won't prescribe anything stonger. But he seems ok with Tramadol. Well it helps. However SWIM does not know of any long term WD from tramadol because he has not taken it for more than a week or so at a time just untill a new supply of oxy is obtained. He just knows that for a short period of no good stuff he can live on the tramadol without being sick.
From what I read so far it looks like GHB can be actually useful for treatment of opiate withdrawal. Here is one paper on this issue:
1993: Gallimberti L; Cibin M; Pagnin P; Sabbion R; Pani P P; Pirastu R; Ferrara S D; Gessa G L
"Gamma-hydroxybutyric acid for treatment of opiate withdrawal syndrome" Neuropsychopharmacology : official publication of the American College of Neuropsychopharmacology
"In a double-blind placebo-controlled trial, gamma-hydroxybutyric acid (GHB) (25 mg/kg orally) suppressed most of the withdrawal symptomatology in 14 heroin addicts and 13 methadone-maintained subjects. The GHB effect was prompt (within 15 minutes) and persisted for between 2 and 3 hours. Subsequently, the same patients received GHB in an open study every 2 to 4 hours for the first 2 days and 4 to 6 hours for the following 6 days: most abstinence signs and symptoms remained suppressed and patients reported felling well. Urine analysis failed to detect any presence of opiate metabolites. No withdrawal symptomatology recurred after 8 days of treatment when GHB was suspended, and patients were challenged with an intravenous injection of 0.4 mg naloxone. The results indicate that GHB may be useful in the management of opiate withdrawal."
And another one:
1994: Luigi Gallimberti, Fabrizio Schifano, Giovanni Forza, Lorella Miconi and S. Davide Ferrara "Clinical efficacy of gamma-hydroxybutyric acid in treatment of opiate withdrawal" European Archives of Psychiatry and Clinical Neuroscience
Volume 244, Number 3 / September, 1994
"This paper describes the role of gamma-hydroxybutyric acid (GHB) in the treatment of opiate withdrawal syndrome. In the two patients described, after having abruptly withdrawn from long-term methadone treatment, GHB was orally administered (each dose given every 4–6 h) for 8–9 days. The GHB showed both a high efficacy (some mild and transient symptoms attributable to opiate withdrawal were observed, but only in the first days of therapy) and a good tolerability (no clinical phenomena interpreted as GHB side effects were found). These results could be of interest in improving the pharmacological treatment of drug addiction."
Last edited by Sushi; 23-09-2009 at 12:02.
swims friend is bupe addict and said that gbl completely takes away buper withdrawals swim friend doesnt get any recreational effects from gbl swim once witnessed the friend take about 5ml of gbl the friend slept for about 10min and then woke about completely fucked up and all he could say was "what" and the friend repeated it for like over an hour that was really scary
Let's not forget that the research related to the use of G for a multitude of conditions concerns GHB, not GBL.
I understand that people may be reluctant to convert to GBL for a myriad of reasons, the sorry state of the drug laws being one but, given what we know about the risks of overdose and withdrawal problems in relation to GBL, I cannot stress highly enough that it should *not* be ingested.
As part of taking GHB for opiate withdrawals, is there a certain time period between last oxycontin intake and first intake of GHB? I assume it is different from taking subutex/suboxone after the last intake of oxycontin?
Do you think you would have to follow a similar plan to the opiod withdrawal record where points are assessed for different stages of withdrawal and you essentially have to be in significant withdrawal or would it be enough to just be in moderate withdrawal?
I understand what you are saying, but if you look at the warnings on both subutex and suboxone it says make sure not to take either with GHB. As a result, that creates a rather difficult situation as to what to do prior to administering the GHB.
In my friends opinion GHB/GBL can be a godsend for Opiat withdrawal. An Opiat withdrawal only takes so long because of not being able to sleep and recuperate properly.
With GHB/GBL you can half the length of withdrawal with its sleeping and recuperative abilities!
While it took him about a week Withdrawal to feel better, with GHB/GBL it took him 3 days of good recuperative sleep to feel alot better!
If you can limit yourself(!) to two bigger nightime Doses and even two lower daytime doses for the anxiety, for the first 3 or 4 days of Withdrawal, an addiction to GHB/GBL wont be a Problem!!