1. Dear Drugs-Forum readers: We are a small non-profit that runs one of the most read drug information & addiction help websites in the world. We serve over 4 million readers per month, and have costs like all popular websites: servers, hosting, licenses and software. To protect our independence we do not run ads. We take no government funds. We run on donations which average $25. If everyone reading this would donate $5 then this fund raiser would be done in an hour. If Drugs-Forum is useful to you, take one minute to keep it online another year by donating whatever you can today. Donations are currently not sufficient to pay our bills and keep the site up. Your help is most welcome. Thank you.
    PLEASE HELP

Drug info - Are Psilocybin Pills Real?

Discussion in 'Magic Mushrooms (Psilocybe & Amanita)' started by Mcfeeli, Apr 3, 2015.

  1. Mcfeeli

    Mcfeeli Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    215
    Messages:
    307
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2012
    from U.S.A.
    Helllooo fair readers of drug forum, I'm just curious about this "shroom" pill I've acquired through my travels. I truly understand that being it containing any actual psilocybin is probably unlikely, but the "Maker" insists that is what it is.

    So I'm just wondering if there is a way to extract psilocybin from the mushrooms or something to that degree. Is that possible? Each time I've taken them there is next to nothing in the capsule. Without proper weighing or anything, I'd liken the amount in the capsule to 1/4 of an average heroin wax paper bag.

    I know there is a whole fuck load psychedelic chemicals out in the world. From what I read most people think it's really AMT that lurks within those gelatin prisons, and for the sake of marketing it's just called a shroom pill. Well the "Maker" is convinced that it's true psilocybin and they know me well enough that I enjoy as they are so there really isn't a reason for them to lie.

    So is it entirely plausible that's what it truly is? It's very, very fucking potent. I split a single capsule with my buddy and we're hallucinating beautifully. It's just astounding to even imagine how that tiny amount powder can orchestrate such results when it'd take an 8th of good mushrooms to compete with. So a highly potent variation of psilocybin? Maybe?
     
  2. ianzombie

    ianzombie Platinum Member & Advisor

    Reputation Points:
    12,325
    Messages:
    10,100
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2007
    42 y/o from ireland
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    It is possible to extract psilocybin, it can be done with a simple alcohol extraction.
    The mushrooms are dried and powdered and added to a jar with alcohol and left for days/weeks and then the liquid is collected and evaporated leaving behind crystals.

    While it is possible it is very unlikely that anyone is bothering with this process as mushrooms are easier to just dry and sell and people like to know what they are getting.
    Any time i have heard of people buying a 'mushroom extract' it turned out to be a research chemical.
     
  3. Ghetto_Chem

    Ghetto_Chem Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    5,336
    Messages:
    3,563
    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2010
    from earth
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    As Ian said, very unlikely. Typically 4-AcO-DMT is sold as "mushroom extract" and since its very closely related to 4-HO-DMT (psilocin) it's nearly impossible to tell the difference. 4-AcO-DMT is also very potent, typical doses are usually 10-30mg. Which sounds about what you have. I'd be willing to bet my left nut that's what it is... And that's my good nut :)

    With that said, 4-AcO-DMT is a great substance and it's theorized that it might metabolize into 4-HO-DMT in the body. Hence the reason why it's effects are nearly indistinguishable.

    -GC
     
  4. Dr.Euphoria

    Dr.Euphoria Mercury Member

    Reputation Points:
    85
    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2015
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    The key to buying form people is ask so many questions that they'll slip up if their lying to you. Do your research, bro. Know more than your dealer.
     
  5. Routemaster Flash

    Routemaster Flash Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    1,577
    Messages:
    1,291
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    from U.K.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    I can't see why anyone would bother to make psilocybin pills, since the compound is already present in dried mushrooms at a pretty good concentration and they keep extremely well as long as they're in a dry environment. What's in it, for either the dealer or the user, to go to the bother of extracting the active compound - probably losing some of it along the way - in order to put it into a new form which is only going to be taken orally anyway?

    I agree with Ghetto that it's likely some close analogue to psilocybin, but then there's the danger that you have no idea what the dosage is other than what this guys tells you - whereas with whole mushrooms you can at least get some very rough idea, even if they do vary a fair bit in potency. But you also have to bear in mind that they could be any old research chemical, and there's a lot of very strong/weird/potentially nasty stuff out there. I mean, it's great that you've enjoyed them so far, but you're still taking a gamble each time you buy the stuff. I suppose it depends to some degree on how much you trust this dealer - e.g. how often does he sample his own produce?
     
  6. Trosiv

    Trosiv Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    70
    Messages:
    77
    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2014
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    Extraction helps with people like me who have a natural tolerance to psychedelics. I can eat 7 grams of tried mushroom and still be lucid. To get the dose where I trip I need to eat a lot of material. Extracting the psilocybin and putting it into pills lets me control my dose easier and it also removes the nausea and vomitting from eating a bunch of mushrooms.

    It also helps people that are prone to nausea or have crohn's disease eat mushrooms and not come up with pain or anxiety.

    I would never buy pills from a dealer though. Much safer to extract it yourself.
     
  7. Routemaster Flash

    Routemaster Flash Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    1,577
    Messages:
    1,291
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    from U.K.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    I suppose if you don't like eating mushrooms or have an allergy then there's aspect to it, of course.

    What I'd love to hear about is a proven tek for extracting psilocybin, freebasing it and then vaping the freebase in a pipe like DMT. I bet that would be amazing, and it has the advantage that in most places mushrooms are infinitely easier to come across than DMT.
     
  8. Trosiv

    Trosiv Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    70
    Messages:
    77
    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2014
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    I did research in the past about this. From what I've read and remember, two problems arise.

    Psilocybin crystals denatures below the point of it vaporizing.
    Psilocybin is a zwitterion and can't be turned into freebase.


    The ideas I have floating in my head to get around it are to put the psilocybin crystals in a vacuum to lower the vaporization temperature below the denaturing point. However how would you ingest it? I've yet to figure that out.

    Or vaporize it in an atmosphere without oxygen. Supposedly it's not the heat that denatures psilocybin but the Oxygen. If you remove the oxygen and replace it with pure n2 maybe you would be able to vape it.
    Of course that brings into question what happens if you breath in pure n2 but I suppose that's why I'm not a chemist.
     
  9. Routemaster Flash

    Routemaster Flash Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    1,577
    Messages:
    1,291
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    from U.K.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    Fascinating post - have you got a source for that information about the properties of psilocybin? It's not that I don't believe you, it just would be good to verify.

    Breathing pure nitrogen would have no effect whatsoever as long as you didn't do it for too long, i.e. about as long as you could comfortably hold your breath. If you could implement some way of vaping the stuff in a pure N2 atmosphere I guess you would take a couple of good deep huffs and then just breathe normally, as you would with nitrous oxide perhaps.
     
  10. Trosiv

    Trosiv Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    70
    Messages:
    77
    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2014
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    I'm not entirely sure the rules on this but another site has a Q A that reads as the following. I PM'd the links to you.

    The same site offers these temps for melting. I can not find any information on boiling temps though.

    I have heard the possibility of it self oxidizing but that's just rumor since it has 4(?) oxygen atoms in the structure.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2015
  11. lololsolid

    lololsolid R.I.P. Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    696
    Messages:
    717
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2010
    from U.S.A.
    Psilocybin pills are ABSOLUTELY REAL! You are extremely unlikely to find them on the street, but in Albert Hofmann's book about LSD he describes how he, his wife, and a couple other scientists went into the depths of mexico to research magic mushrooms. They brought with them psilocybin pills they had created in his laboratory, and gave some of these pills to the "curandera" (shaman). The curandera said that the pills did indeed contain the "spirit" of the mushrooms (the active ingredient).

    Any drug can be put into pill form, mushrooms are no different. However, because street vendors are lazy and people don't believe in psilocybin pills, you will almost never see these being sold.

    To those of you asking what the purpose of putting psilocybin into a pill would be: IT'S TO CONTROL AND KNOW THE EXACT DOSAGE ADMINISTERED.
     
  12. rawbeer

    rawbeer Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    4,818
    Messages:
    1,733
    Joined:
    May 25, 2008
    from U.S.A.
    ^^^ Sandoz manufactured psilocybin pills along with their "delysid" LSD back in the 1960s. That's what Hoffman is describing. I doubt any of those still exist; if they do they would be priceless. They were apparently available on the black market into the 1970s.

    As has been mentioned above, your odds of getting eaten by a shark are probably higher than buying actual psilocybin in pill form these days.
     
  13. lololsolid

    lololsolid R.I.P. Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    696
    Messages:
    717
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2010
    from U.S.A.
    Raw, I am curious. Even though they were perhaps discontinue many years ago, wouldn't it still be possible to synthetically create psilocybin to add to pill if you had the proper chemistry knowledge? That also raises the question of "how come nobody in super-labs makes Quaaludes (Methaqualone) anymore? Even though it was discontinued by pharmaceutical companies, anybody with the proper lab setup and reagents can make anything they want. I know people home-make aplrazolam, why do they not make other things like psilocybin or methaqualone?
     
  14. trdofbeingtrd

    trdofbeingtrd Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    4,942
    Messages:
    3,142
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    Now it's time to basically prove I am not a chemist.....but, it's an idea.

    From what I understand, the reason you cannot vapor the crystals is because of oxygen. Nitrogen could possibly work except for the possible and plausible dangers from heavy/frequent inhalation of nitrogen.
    The
    Once you vape the crystals with nitrogen, can that vape be filtered into an oxygen "environment" for human consumption?
     
  15. rawbeer

    rawbeer Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    4,818
    Messages:
    1,733
    Joined:
    May 25, 2008
    from U.S.A.
    lolosolid, the reason no one synthesizes psilocybin pills is because growing mushrooms is much, much easier and cheaper and requires much less equipment. And as Ianzombie pointed out earlier people like to see what they're getting, and that's one of the wonderful things about mushrooms as well as cannabis - you can actually get a pretty good idea of the quality with a simple visual inspection.

    Maybe some curious chemistry students do it. My guess is that psilocybin pills would cost so much more to make than just growing mushrooms, that no one would pay the prices needed for the manufacturer to make a decent profit. You would just be taking the long way around to get some psilocybin. Why bother when nature can do the heavy lifting?

    I've heard of chemistry students manufacturing rare drugs for the thrill of it, and sometimes small amounts of them trickle onto the market. But again, we're talking shark attack, lightning strike odds compared to getting some misrepresented Research Chemical or analog.
     
  16. lololsolid

    lololsolid R.I.P. Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    696
    Messages:
    717
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2010
    from U.S.A.
    Excellent point. I suppose once a person has a lab setup and all the reagents they want, manufacturing a rare drug for a thrill could be interesting. Personally though, I'd never risk my degree or freedom to do so :p

    Still, the pills would be so much more effective. No nausea, no risk of poisonous shrooms, no risk of excess moldiness, and they store for essentially a lifetime. A man can dream, a man can dream :)
     
  17. Trosiv

    Trosiv Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    70
    Messages:
    77
    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2014
    from U.S.A.
    Re: Psilocybin Pills/how?

    It's definitely possible but one issue I see is if you mix the nitrogen/Psilo air with oxygen too soon maybe it'll degrade. Optimally you would not want to mix it until it is already being inhaled. Having two nozzles/nipples/whatever it is you suck on, one being the mixture of N2 and the other O2.

    Or if you were going to get really fancy. Have the mixture be inhaled first followed by the O2. That way there is no combination but you still receive Oxygen.


    I'll have to re-create the glorious piece I theorized in paint some time and upload it.
    I would need the help of actual chemists to figure out if what I'm doing is actually plausible though.
     
  18. rawbeer

    rawbeer Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    4,818
    Messages:
    1,733
    Joined:
    May 25, 2008
    from U.S.A.
    As Ianzombie pointed out it really isn't that hard to extract psilocybin and get it into some capsules. I've tried making both liquid and powder extracts but I find I always lose enough potency that I regret it afterwards. I used to get bad nausea from shrooms but I think a lot of it has to do with how you consume them.

    I now prefer to slowly chew them up. Hold some in your mouth and slowly chew, allowing your saliva to soften the dried material. I know, you're probably getting sick just thinking about it, right? It's psychological, unless you have some cow-pie shrooms. The standard commercial cubensis, if cured right, really isn't that bad. I used to chop them up and wash them down with liquid but I think getting them soft helps digestion. I've tried the slow chew - the traditional way Maria Sabina practiced - and never get nauseous (well, the first time I gagged at first until I accepted that it wasn't so bad). Albert Hoffman actually believed that doing it this way caused much of the psilocybin to be absorbed buccally. I find it tends to come on slower and last longer, and is all around more pleasant.

    But there is a thrill to taking a psychoactive plant and getting it into a pill or a bottle. And I have a pretty strong stomach. If you're willing to sacrifice potency or put more effort into doing a grade A extraction there's no reason you can't have your own psilly-pills!
     
  19. lololsolid

    lololsolid R.I.P. Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    696
    Messages:
    717
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2010
    from U.S.A.
    This is exactly why I prefer to stick with LSD... and because LSD is just more effective than shrooms :p

    But I guess there is always the satisfaction of growing your own.
     
  20. TheBigBadWolf

    TheBigBadWolf Apprentice Sorcerer Palladium Member Donating Member

    Reputation Points:
    10,947
    Messages:
    5,841
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    from Germany, Federal Republic of
    Rawbeer's chewing technique is very effecttive, I used to put the amount I wanted to take in my cheek pouch and let te saliva make them soft and swell up to nearly harvesting size, always having sweeties in my mouth ( baaaad for teeth! but good for not getting sick!) up to half an hour, sometimes until the effects came on, sucked them all as dry as possible and even spat the plant material out again.

    BBW