1. Dear Drugs-Forum readers: We are a small non-profit that runs one of the most read drug information & addiction help websites in the world. We serve over 4 million readers per month, and have costs like all popular websites: servers, hosting, licenses and software. To protect our independence we do not run ads. We take no government funds. We run on donations which average $25. If everyone reading this would donate $5 then this fund raiser would be done in an hour. If Drugs-Forum is useful to you, take one minute to keep it online another year by donating whatever you can today. Donations are currently not sufficient to pay our bills and keep the site up. Your help is most welcome. Thank you.
    PLEASE HELP
    Dismiss Notice

Arguments presented for/against the use of Adderall

Discussion in 'Adderall' started by Megan288, Mar 26, 2012.

  1. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Dr.'s don't have enough scrutiny for prescription drugs because of the billion dollar industry's influence. 8 billion dollars can effect sober drs' common sense. my dad's an eye dr and I worked for him. I've been on medscape. I've seen all of this stuff first hand.

    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/1998/07/06/244798/index.htm

    Megan288 added 0 Minutes and 42 Seconds later...

    well, motivation will be nonexistant. off the radar. I'm saying what you have to do won't even be in the back of your mind and nothing will be nagging you except for the fact that you know nothing's nagging you and your brain isn't working and for the first time in your life you don't care about anything.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2012
  2. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I wish treatment hadn't been an option for me. I do realize that there was a huge push in the mental health movement in the 90's and that is why there are so many prescription drugs sold. Of course, the research is bias because it is all funded by pharmaceutical companies... so of course the answer was always going to be... "meds and therapy is the most effective treatment"... for just about everything.
     
  3. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    Do you have any experience in treating mental illness at all or have you ever known someone with a mental illness? For instance, have you ever seen an extremely paranoid schizophrenic off of their medication? They are violent, agitated beyond belief, and have insanely delusional thoughts, such a person is uncontrollable and harmful to themselves and others. Believe it or not the "drugs" from the pharmaceutical company are extremely effective at treating paranoid schizophrenics, almost making them normal again, thats just one example.
     
  4. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    key word : extreme

    no, I have no experience with extremely, truly mentally ill people.

    I have seen truly ADHD hyperactive boys. Sometimes meds work for them, sometimes they don't.

    I one hundred percent acknowledge that meds would always work for someone who was mentally ill. I'm not, you're not, and neither is the original poster.

    Megan288 added 6 Minutes and 6 Seconds later...

    I really hope big pharma and the researchers are working to get a handle on the prescription drug problem they've created, even though they probably will never acknowledge it and I doubt there will ever be a day again when people who don't need to be on drugs aren't on drugs.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2012
  5. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    What do you think ADD is, which swim has? Not a mental disorder? Because it is... It's not even arguable because it is a mental disorder.
     
  6. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I agree, and I have it. I just don't think Adderall is controlled enough, and I think there are other interventions that work for many people with add instead of medicine.
    I actually don't think I ever needed an intervention and I never needed medicine. The whole mental health system just made things weaker. Things like exercise, doing work, and doing what you need to do to compensate for whatever it is you have is the best thing more often than not.
     
  7. Stepin Fetchit

    Stepin Fetchit Banned

    Reputation Points:
    -105
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    154
    Re: Adderall for academia

    You are the perfect example of how people are supposed to take medication. First, you actually HAVE ADD, and were diagnosed by a doctor, and second, you don't take more than you are supposed to. Also, you are concerned with the drug helping you by alleviating your ADD but you aren't concerned with feeling any "high" or "euphoria" from taking your Adderall.

    I can't stand hearing people attest to how bad Adderall is, and run down a laundry list of side effects that they are supposedly feeling, some of which are simply made up rumors, when they are obvious drug addicts.

    Many that claim to take Adderall regularly freely admit that they don't have a prescription for it, as if it doesn't even matter, and talk about how they binge out on the drug and then take other drugs to counter the side effects.

    Well first, if you don't have ADD, then you don't need it, and if you are misdiagnosed (or you stupidly diagnose yourself like many do) you are supposed to stop taking it if it makes you feel bad. This is not a drug that you become hopelessly chemically and psychologically addicted to after taking it a few times.

    But the hyperbole of Adderall's reputation is worse than the actual drug, and it is plainly obvious that many Adderall users plan to abuse it when they ask their doctor for it in the first place! Well, I'm sorry druggies, but if you go into the doctor's office will unethical intentions you can't blame the drug, the pharmaceutical companies, or lack of government oversight for problems that you created.

    Many seem to talk as if they don't understand how Adderall can be used for anything BUT abuse, like it's some drug that the government regulators missed and there is nothing that can be done, or that there's some massive conspiracy to keep children on it.

    The funny thing is, what the abuses of Adderall medication don't realize, is that you actually feel better on low doses of amphetamines than you do if you abuse your prescription! Taking twice, three times, four times, the recommended dose does nothing but make the person jittery, agitated, unfocused and unable to comprehend what's going on around them, and the crash is very unpleasant. But when you take a low dose, twice a day, once when youngetnupmand mce about 4 hours later, you are alert, lucid, calm, articulate, aware of what's going on around you, and if you have ADD it allows you to prioritize your lifestyle the way you want and you aren't starting things and stopping them, forgetting about them and then rushing to finish everything at the last minute, etc.

    And guess what, druggies? You aren't supposed to snort ADD medication! It doesn't get you higher, it just gets stuck in your nose and makes you gag! You can snort cocaine and meth because these compounds are Hydrocloride powders, and they are relatively pure, but Adderall pills (and Ritalin, etc.) have fillers/binding agents that make them inappropriate to snort. The reason people feel like they are getting high from snorting pills that shouldn't be snorted is simply a conditioned response; you're putting something up your nose, so you must be getting high. Ridiculous.

    So, if you are abusing prescription medications like Adderall, blame yourself, not the drug's power, not the pharmaceutical companies, not the government, not the doctors who prescribed it to you, not your parents who took your hyper ass to the doctor because you were a terror at school. If you couldn't get prescription meds, you probably would have been one of those idiots who huffs paint, drinks caugh syrup, or chokes the self to get high. You can't fix stupid.

    Stepin Fetchit added 14 Minutes and 19 Seconds later...

    I don't agree with Megan's assessment of Adderall, although I know she had a some bad experiences around the time she was taking them, so she understandably believes that the drug was the issue. Maybe someone even told her that they objected to her taking it because they heard about how bad it was, and she let that notion internalize a perceived problem.

    But Megan isn't an addict. She never had a drinking problem, never smoked pot, never took any prescription meds without a prescription, and basically wouldn't even take an aspirin unless she had a really bad headache. So, it wouldn't make sense that if her behavior was mpnegatively affected by taking Adderall for her to continue taking it; she'd simply stop taking it.

    But Megan has said that the signs that the Adderall was negatively affecting her was that her boyfriend broke up with her, and that she got straight A's. That's not the description of a drug addict's life.

    I think that the reason that Megan feels crummy now is because she stopped taking a drug that was actually helping her. In also believe that she is suffering from depression that is ever not being treated or is i under treated. So, I understand that she is wanting to speak out about the dangers of prescription drug abuse, but I believe that she should focus on trying to educate the potential abuses rather than the drug companies and doctors.

    Stepin Fetchit added 2 Minutes and 55 Seconds later...

    I'm not sure that trying to compensate for your mental illness or problems in your life is a healthy manner of treatment. Maybe you didn't mean "compensate..."

    Anyone in the mental health field would raise a red flag tip they heard someone talking about trying to compensate for their problems by focusing on something else.

    Stepin Fetchit added 8 Minutes and 5 Seconds later...

    Most people don't HATE their jobs, but very few actually get to do the one thing that they have always dreamed of doing and that they love doing. If that were the case, there'd be 1,000,000 rock stars and thousands of rock stars.

    You aretpnt going to believe me, but you may realize this in a few years after you finish school, but there is a strong possibility that you will be disappointed when you enter the work force. Education is fantastic, but I think itnleads too many people to believe that there is this great job waiting for all of them, but there isn't. Doing what makes you happy might require you to focus energy outside your job.

    I do know this: it is natural forma person where youre at to be soul searching, but your idea that you have a lack of motivation problem that could be solved by taking a drug is misguided. It's not that simple. The answer to whatever you feel is missing, whether it be motivation or something else, is more powerful than any drug, but you will have to search a little harder to find it.

    Stepin Fetchit added 2 Minutes and 4 Seconds later...

    ...says the chronic workaholic. Problems can't be solved by ignoring them.

    Stepin Fetchit added 6 Minutes and 49 Seconds later...

    Megan, wow. I feel for you, I really do, but if you feel depressed when you quit taking Adderall, then your problem wasn't Adderall, you have depression. You weren't taking enough Adderall to have caused depression.

    Also, when you are taking a drug and just stop taking it, and then start to feel bad, it's because the drug was working. I'm not saying that Adderall was the perfect thing for you to be taking, I'm saying stopping abruptly isn't a good idea.

    I think the whole cognitive ability thing is in your mind, because you are very bright, obviously, plus someone who losses cognitive ability wouldn't be able to explain themselves so well (or be able to use the term cognitive ability correctly).

    Stepin Fetchit added 1 Minutes and 11 Seconds later...

    Everyone ismtiredmand cranky in the morning...
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2012
  8. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I don’t think you can focus all of the blame on the patients, there are too many, and that is not getting anywhere. There are too many dr’s, too. the people that make all the medicine need to ship it out with an information sheet to drs, easy and done. Dr.’s are supposed to interpret all of the information on their own.

    In hindsight, I just needed to know what was going on and I know all of the information now. Most people don’t know it, and it should be given to them at the first apt.
    I think the company knows what they should be doing. 20/20 did a special on it and the fda kept turning the reporters to other government agencies. They pay dr’s to prescribe their drugs and have a huge advertising campaign that goes beyong that. I don’t have enough power to be focusing on informing the pts, and I hate advocating like this, the company should do it, so I don’t have to worry about it. It would just take a piece of paper with every first prescription. That’s what the top research recommends anyway. It’s crucial.

    That might be a little bit true, I’m not sure. But it did change my personality, my ex said I was night and day and I’d never had that rocky of a relationship before, ever! I do think Adderall was what got me where I am in the first place. I was trying to do the right things. As far as my ex bf goes I actually broke up with and stopped taking adderall and was too depressed about my actions to think straight, especially for the first month.


    Thank you. I was really, really shaken up. It’s not like me but, I avoided a lot for a month, including school, phone calls. It was weird.
    Not stopping right away instead of titrating off was really dumb, especially in the middle of a semester at grad school. I didn’t know this, definitely should have, though. Thank you and I honestly appreciate your perspective, your viewpoint is awesome. Even though I’ve argued with everyone on this thread, you’ve been really reassuring.

    I believe that. That’s something better to think about.

    Megan288 added 28 Minutes and 27 Seconds later...

    Really? where?? Why aren't they on the side effects list? All they mention referring to long term is "chronic use" I've looked for long term studies and have not found any. Are they from legitimate sources? Two years is better than 3-4 weeks but I don't think I'd call that long term really..

    I am not meaning to do this at all. I don't think he'll have these problems. He's already informed of everything it took me forever to figure out and I've hijacked his thread...

    I've reported them to my dr. I think you can't report side effects after a month of stopping use. Which I've stopped and started a few times in the last few years.

    I would never sue my dr. He has a lot to do and so many drugs to administer to all kinds of different patients. The pharmaceutical companies know that they should give the information to the dr's so they can prevent problems. They don't want people to see warnings. The FDA makes them put all their warnings on their and they do it reluctantly and fight to have them taken down.

    Or they should just not give their controlled II, strong, drugs to PCP's to prescribe. Someone should see a specialist before they start taking adderall. It's a huge decision they need to be informed about.

    Lucky gal, I know some people who have been medicated since they were kids and they don't have issues and have been productive. I'm sure their parents monitored closely to make sure everything went smoothly.

    They have to report all private funding... what good does that do? That just explains why 70% of research you read on ADHD has Funded by Shire written underneath it.

    Megan288 added 5 Minutes and 18 Seconds later...

    I'd like to read more about this. Still, for the majority of drs in the us, pharmaceutical companies are all over their practice.. their research... Might not be what people want to read but it's so true.


    I 100% agree. If they aren't going to make it easy for dr.'s to give correct information to first time adderall patients (which would be easy to do with one formal piece of paper from the companies for every first time patient.. which is what is recommended but not required..) they shouldn't give their medicine or send their reps into all of the dr's offices. The pharmaceutical companies need to ship everything out with a warning for all of the people that will be taking their drugs. Instead of making each individual primary care physician or clinical nurse try to interpret how adderall is supposed to work.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  9. IDDQD

    IDDQD Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    Messages:
    17
    Re: Adderall for academia

    "You aretpnt going to believe me, but you may realize this in a few years after you finish school, but there is a strong possibility that you will be disappointed when you enter the work force. Education is fantastic, but I think itnleads too many people to believe that there is this great job waiting for all of them, but there isn't. Doing what makes you happy might require you to focus energy outside your job.

    I do know this: it is natural forma person where youre at to be soul searching, but your idea that you have a lack of motivation problem that could be solved by taking a drug is misguided. It's not that simple. The answer to whatever you feel is missing, whether it be motivation or something else, is more powerful than any drug, but you will have to search a little harder to find it."

    I've been in industry for years... As I said, I had a job before going to get my Master's. I just took a hiatus. I've had my current job for four years, which is not that long, but long enough. Before that I had two other jobs, as well, both a year long. Again, nothing significant, but enough to know about being in the workforce.
     
  10. Stepin Fetchit

    Stepin Fetchit Banned

    Reputation Points:
    -105
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    154
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I think I've asked you before, and I didn't get a straight answer, or maybe I missed it, but if you experienced side effects, then why didn't you stop taking them? Someone shouldn't have to tell you about a side effect for you to notice it.

    Also, I'm not sure if this is law, it may depend on the pharmacy, but I was given a sheet with side effects when I picked up my prescription.

    I actually started taking some drug before I started Lexepro, an anti-depressant, and I tried it three times. It made me feel awful, so I stopped taking it and told my doctor. It wasn't a fun couple of days, but that was the extent of it.

    I don't think that your boyfriend telling you that you were "night and day" different on Adderall means anything. Maybe it just wasn't a compatible relationship.

    Stepin Fetchit added 2 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...

    If that'll true, then you don't have ADD, and you don't need Adderall. Taking it wil likely cause you to become dependent on it, and this could cause you to abuse it. If you didn't need it when you were in the work force them you don't need it now.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  11. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I don't think I read past the common side effects on the rx bag which didn't include what I should have been looking for anyway. But, I'm just dependent on it and don't have time to try antidepressents. I'm going to go back for a masters. Adderall makes me happier but it's fake.

    I was compatible with everyone. normally I would have been much sweet and conscientious. At least I know if I ever am in a comfortable spot and don't have a lot of work to do I can go off of it and be compatible with everyone again.
     
  12. IDDQD

    IDDQD Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    Messages:
    17
    Re: Adderall for academia

    It's an error to equate all mentally strenuous functions to a non-research job.

    Jobs are generally highly structured, provide consistent rewards (money), and often include daily or weekly progress checks. They are also exceedingly easy, in most cases. This has been my experience, at least.

    Research is nothing like holding a job, unless your job happen to be in academia or industry labs.

    I did a a minimal amount of work at my job. I didn't have to pay much attention nor did I need much in the way of motivation. It simply isn't difficult to sit in a chair for 8 hours and type the same sorts of things you have been typing for years.
     
  13. Stepin Fetchit

    Stepin Fetchit Banned

    Reputation Points:
    -105
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    154
    Re: Adderall for academia

    If you are going to do what you want anyway, then why even ask?

    By the way, someone with ADD WOULD have difficulty sitting in a chair all day and typing the same thing over and over, and it would be unlikelymfor them to be as good a student as you.

    Stepin Fetchit added 1 Minutes and 9 Seconds later...

    I guess it was all the Adderall's fault then...
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  14. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    Your statements are completely false. The side effects sheet is for people who should not be taking this drug. This is tied to someone having a predisposed condition that disqualifies them from taking the drug, such as someone with already high blood pressure, taking adderall will amplify their blood pressure. The side effect sheet is to make the user aware of a serious problem within their body due to how the drug is interacting inside the body. Thus, IF YOU EXPERIENCE SIDE EFFECTS, you should immediately stop and tell a doctor. A doctor will, without hesitation, switch the prescription or lower the dose so the side effects are diminished entirely. The user should not have side effects, and if they do the dose is to high or being abused.

    And to your second statement regarding your "side effects" from taking adderall are also false. You were prescribed 10 mg XR and because you didn't feel any effect from the drug you assumed that it was not working. Because of this you had your prescription changed to 20 mg XR. Little did you know that the smaller dose was working, but because you didn't "feel it", you assumed it wasn't working.
    This is an extremely fallacious statement based on prediction alone, and as you stated you took the 10 mg dose for one month before switching. So in one months time you had no side effects from dosing at 10 mg, which is probably your recommended dose. However, since you upped the dosage to 20 mg you over stimulated the effect of the drug.

    This has nothing to do with my education or opinion. I'm basing these argument's on factual data, not assumption and prediction. People who don't know much about a drug they are taking shouldn't be taking the drug in the first place and that is their own fault for being irresponsible.


    I'd also like to add that you underestimate the power of the brain, and how it controls your behavior. The reason they test drugs on people having one control (placebo) versus the variable (adderall), isn't just to show the effects that come out, but to show how a person's brain can impact the way they think and make them believe they're actually having these effects. Every single effect felt from users who take the adderall are also felt in the users who took the placebo. Most studies regarding the effects of adderall are based on less than one percent (1%<) of the users in that study.

    People who have side effects from a drug shouldn't be taking the drug. For obvious reasons, such as they are abusing it, taking to much of it, or don't need the drug for what their using it for.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  15. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I think you are as defensive of Adderall as I have to be for myself. I didn't know when I reported these side effects people would look at my like they had no clue what I was talking about because they are trying to defend their drug. It's not like anyone is going to take it away from you, it's yours, you can keep it, sleep with it, wake up and take it tomorrow, study about it.
     
  16. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    This is another common fallacy, argument ad hominem. Probably because of the fact that your view point of adderall is narcissistic. You're in denial because you don't want to believe what I'm saying is true. You're viewpoints are skewed and based on prediction and assumption. I'm not the only one that refute's the statement's you've made either. My viewpoints are based on actual evidence and factual data.

    I would gladly write a research paper regarding the use of adderall, but by going out of my way to do so, I would scrutinize the falsity behind every statement you've made in complete detail.

    I've been posting things unbiasedly and without offense to anyone on here because the reason people come here is for these kinds of answers. But telling people things that are completely untrue and based on the proclivity of your adderall use doesn't make it true or factual to say the least.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  17. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    I'm the opposite of someone who is narcissistic.
    Megan288 added 0 Minutes and 28 Seconds later...

    whenever someone starts using that term it makes me want to run away from the internet
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2012
  18. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    Thus you shouldn't be taking adderall to begin with. Everything you've said is contradictory to what you make claims to. You blame adderall for changing your life, but you made the choice in your brain to take it. You also made the choice to keep taking it despite the fact you were experiencing side effects.

    As swim posted earlier, swims never had side effects one time, nor has he developed an addiction to this drug. He also takes the drug like he's supposed to at a dosage that is appropriate to his weight. Sorry to the OP for having these side conversations and in my defense, I was countering the criticism placed on my post. Don't take advice from the users who base their evidence on abusing the drug.

    This statement shows your lack of knowledge. The first thing you learn about being a pharmacist is how to communicate with people. For instance, people come in on a daily basis asking for drugs and falsifying prescription slips because they are an addict. Holding a grudge against them has got to do with nothing because if you fail to pick up on how they are communicating with you, there's the potential of losing your license to practice pharmacy.

    If anyone agrees with her statement about "people who don't know how to handle it, knowing absolutely nothing about drugs in the first place", should rethink their viewpoint on drugs. I thought this statement would be common sense to most people because what it's implying is if you ever find a pill on the floor and have no idea what it is, who care's just take it. If you don't know how to handle a drug, and know absolutely nothing about that drug, then YOU SHOULD NOT BE TAKING THIS DRUG.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  19. Megan288

    Megan288

    Age:
    30
    Reputation Points:
    -65
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    115
    Re: Adderall for academia

    You are informed about adderall. Which is why you are so extremely regimented about your dose. You know how controlled it needs to be. You should get out of the science world and into the real world where all kinds of well intentioned people are having problems with adderall at recommended, prescribed doses. There is a difference between a choice and an informed choice. You're a pharmacy student. Don't hold such a grudge about people when they don't know how potentially harmful and destructive your beloved drug can be.

    Megan288 added 5 Minutes and 23 Seconds later...

    It can exacerbate mental illness, it can also induce it. New or worsening mental problems, does not mean someone had something wrong with them in the first place. That means Adderall caused them to have something wrong with them. If that happens to someone they are not going to be really happy with you when you actually put the blame back on them. I don't know what they teach you in pharmacy school, but you should acknowledge that Adderall causes problems for people. I bet it's all influenced by the pharmaceutical companies, huh. That would make sense in regards to your attitude.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2012
  20. chrischerokee

    chrischerokee Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    89
    Re: Adderall for academia

    YOU ARE WRONG! There is no such evidence to justify this statement at all. You need to come out of this fantasy bubble of creating fictitious explanations to justify the side effects you've experienced. I don't understand why you continue to refute facts. This is invalid reasoning and you still continue to claim you're right basing your explanations on nothing at all. Your logic is inaccurate and fallacious.