Opinions - Before you pop your brain pills, consider this...

Discussion in 'Antipsychotics' started by IHrtHalucingens, Jun 22, 2006.

  1. IHrtHalucingens

    IHrtHalucingens Palladium Member

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    I fundamentally agree with you, most people get fat because of their own personal habits and habits can cause symptoms of depression and such. And i do believe that all of our medecations and procedures are slowing, if not haulting, the evolution of our species.

    But i dont agree with such a generalizing statement. Some people have legitimate medical conditions that dont allow them to metabolize foods the proper way and have glandular(SP) conditions that cause their obesity. In theory these people should be left alone so that nature can take its course and they cannot pass on these unwanted genes.

    But in reality everyone has a right to life, and the best one possible at that, so if these medications can improve their way of life then by all means they should take full advantage of them.
     
  2. INodHardOhYeah

    INodHardOhYeah Gold Member

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    Medicines are intended to be supplemental to a healthy life sytle. That is why such drugs are often called supplements. If a woman with high cholesteral exercises, improves her diet, and still finds herself with cholesteral and often times blood pressure problems, this is when prescription drugs become advantages.

    I really would advise against trying to avoid going to the doctor for the rest of your life. I'm not sure how old your are but as you age your chances of contracting or developing serious diseases and illness' increases. I know a prostate exam is no fun but if it keeps me alive, I'll allow myself to be probed every now and again.

    Mental health works the same way, medicinal treatment is only part of your treament, in addition to a healhty lifestyle as stated above, and talk therapy (psychology)

    I really find it very strange that so many people on this board, drugs forum, consider psychiatry to be bunk and believe that psychiatrists don't have your best interests at heart.

    Many (not all) members of this forum claim to be so much about opening and expanding their minds and yet, are so incredibly closed minded.
     
  3. bewilderment

    bewilderment Drug Geek Extraordinaire Platinum Member & Advisor

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    I've been clinically depressed since a young age and there have been times when even though I am living a healthy lifestyle, I am suddenly hit with that black wave. When this happens, it's sometimes all I can do to actually crawl out of bed and shower. Forget trying to exercise, I'm too busy sobbing. Also, forget eating healthy, I can barely remember to eat much less actually bring it upon myself to care. Antidepressants have saved my life a few times and give me the energy and motivation to actually lead a healthy lifestyle. I often find that I am unnable to keep up a healthy lifestyle unless I am medicated. I do agree, however, that people are overmedicated and I take only the minimal amount of medication I need to function regardless of what my doctor has prescribed me. I also see that you are referring to a program where people are monitored and made to lead a healthy lifestyle. I doubt they would've had the motivation to implement this themselves without the supervision.
     
  4. Powder_Reality

    Powder_Reality Gold Member

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    I can agree from personal experience that some psychiatrists will treat you like a guinea pig and test a bunch of different pill combos on you, usually followed by unpleasant side effects. But on the other hand, some psychiatrists will try to help you with alternative methods before they start to prescribe you pills. I had a psychiatrist who used cognitive behavioural therapy to treat my OCD, and it worked better than any medication my other psychiatrist ever prescribed me. Of course, this was just my experience, and some people might not respond the same way as I did. Although some people may need prescriptions for their more extreme symtoms and conditions, I always like try to avoid medications until I absolutely need them. This includes things like eating healthy and getting rest instead of taking antibiotics for a flu or common cold. But if I feel that I absolutely need something to calm me down and settle my mental/physical pain, I'm not going to put myself through hell because I don't want to use my prescription.
     
  5. bewilderment

    bewilderment Drug Geek Extraordinaire Platinum Member & Advisor

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    This reminds me of yesterday when I took a trip with my wife up to see her psychiatrist. My wife is manic-depressive, has ADD, and generalized anxiety disorder. These are all real and not made up by her doctors as I have witnessed how she is when she is not medicated. Her current regimen before the visit was: wellbutrin, lamictal, adderall, and klonopin. This is a good combo for her, but she almost always has a hard time getting the adderall even though I know for a fact that she doesn't abuse it. She recently started a new job which has been stressing her out. Her dosage of adderall prescribed was rather low: 20mg XR which means it's extended release and released in 10mg increments. She built a little bit of a tolerance because she had to study and be able to focus and be awake during training so she began taking two a day because that's what she needed to function. When she ran out, her ADD returned and she's now having a lot of problems focusing while on the job and that's causing her a lot of stress and making her get into a kind of funk. She says she feels numb and told her doctor so. She also asked to see if she could get her adderall dosage upped so she could do better on the job where she has to be mentally sharp. The doctor not only did not give her a new script for adderall, the doctor prescribed her trazadone for sleep. Trazadone is a dirty old antidepressant which is now only used for insomnia. This is what I mean when I refer to overmedication. I've had a doctor do this before as well. I was on an antidepressant which exacerbated my already pre-existant insomnia, the antidepressant also made me feel a bit numb. So, he prescribed another outdated antidepressant called Remeron which I believe only screwed up my head even more and made me gain weight. It did knock me out at night, but I'd wake up groggy and feeling even more like a zombie.

    The US is outrageous, doctors need to actually start listening to their patients when they request a certain medication or say that they need the dosage upped. Of course, they need to be able to judge the situation and tell whether or not a person is abusing the drugs. But, in my wife's case, her psychological history is well-documented and these are medications designed for her condition(s). Trazadone is something not even for her condition and she doesn't even have severe insomnia, it's something that could easily be treated with a lesser sleep-aid like ambien or something. A person, especially one with psychiatric illness and especially bipolar, shouldn't be given an old antidepressant for sleep as the first line of offense.

    I often find myself hating doctors too. But, I also need my medication...I really do mean "need", I keep trying to go off of it but after about a month and a half I usually go nuts again.
     
    1. 4/5,
      Total agreement, anti-depressants are known to do wacky things to us bipolars!
      Jun 6, 2009
    2. 5/5,
      mega rating for your uploads in the image gallery. Please request a new category for new artists next time, as that safes me a lot of work. Alfa
      Jun 24, 2006
  6. Akewstick

    Akewstick Silver Member

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    Right On! stick it to the man!

    I'm of the opinion that if without medication i become a machete weilding headcase, then a machete weilding headcase is who i'm supposed to be, and i don't want to be filled up with prescription pills to turn me into a clockwork orange, i'd rather be out there being myself and weilding a machete.

    Having said this, I don't agree with the original post, i don't have any less respect for people who take prescription stuff to do anything to their head. My view on the subject is: if you want to take it, take it. I'm not telling you to take it or not take it, i'm not even telling you to understand what it does to you, if you don't want to research it, don't.

    I think, if someone were to read TheTrueBlackMeat's and do it because he'd told you to, you're as much a brainless drone as you are for obeying any government approved, doctor-prescribed medical routine.

    I have been prescribed antidepressants, and he's glad of it, I found that histamine-blocking anti depressants make Diphenhydramine abuse that little bit more amazing.

    SWIM never stuck to his guidelines on medication, he saved them up and took a week's worth on a quiet friday night with half a box of nytol. I have a childish love of "beating the system", it's why he loves DXM and getting smacked up on a box of codeine-paracetemol pills, pushes through some filter paper.

    Apart from my ideas about who i am, and how medication would change me, and that being something I don't want, there is not a single group of people i would trust less with my mental health than psychiatrists. In all my experiences with psychiatrists, councellors and therapists, i've found them to be more concerned with paperwork, forms and the requirements they need to meet for their job than my best intrests to a degree i never imagined they could get away with.

    I'm not saying psychiatrists are evil, i'm saying they don't give a good fuck about me because they have no reason to.

    All I ask you to think about it this:
    You might want to fix the symptoms of some disorder someone in a white coat says you have, but 6 months from now, when it's fixed, you might be someone else, and you won't even know it, and then it'll be too late for you to decide wether or not you want to be the new person, because you'll be dead, replaced with a clockwork orange

    This might not happen, but it might, and personally, i don't want to take the risk.

     
  7. stoneinfocus

    stoneinfocus Silver Member

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    In fact swic has gotten al of the symptons of an depressiion adn strong fear by imprisionment and mind-washing, because of false statements of swics parents.

    how can one tell who is criminal and who´s insane, amyway, who gets the right to have a clear mind and an attorney and who´s deportated without discussion and immediatly drugged, although completely peaceful?

    the püsychiatry is absolutely useless and still doing much tio much harm to mankind, and the way the mentality is, these times,it will stay like that forevver.

    If mentality in people would change, psychiatrist weren´t necessary, those few, who can´t be cured anyway, because they´re sick ,could be treated by "normal" medical means.
    and whar was that " a chain is as strong as the weakest link" conmsidering freedom and the human rights are the chain compared to $5150 being the weakest link? There u go!
    I sometimes think they really are conspirative, since swics parents are very fundamental and those they know might be too, with the same attitudes and
    in a distinguished social postion, like attorbneys, Education and ... doctors?

    It takes a few words and a simple plan only to fuck up a live like swics if you knew swics live that well and got that much power over it like parents would have, if they´d intervent on it, since you´re ten years old or even younger.
     
  8. stoneinfocus

    stoneinfocus Silver Member

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    fashsim and hybris in it´s pirest form!

    A ICU surgeon willl do his work, because he thinks he might get into the same situation he sees 100x daily, a psychiatrists is someone whit a clearer and healthier mind than you and knows what´s good for you better than u do.:confused:
    Only if they´re letting you decide if you like to take the risk.
    How many are in those clinics at their own will? those who are, have imho only a luxery probleme and are curious and/or intersted in psychology themselves, meaning they´d be much smarter if they were intersted an concerned about mental health and psychology .... well ... .:eek:
     
  9. Akewstick

    Akewstick Silver Member

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    Well yeah, and i'm against forcing people into that situation, but if someone is going to rape and murder if they're set free, and have done in the past, what do you do then? I don't have the answer.

    I wasn't talking about being inside a clinic, living there and eating their medicine, I was talking about people who just get scripts for anti-psychotics and anti-depressants, and have the option wether to take them or not.
     
  10. mickenator

    mickenator Titanium Member

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    I know that when some people treat you different when they find out that you have a mental illness, but I have found that upto now being honest has paid off for me, my last 2 bosses have known that Iam a schizophrenic and have to take my medication but both have treat me the same way they treat any of there other staff. Iam now unable to function normally without my Olanzapine and find that if I miss 3 days then the demons start coming back. I think it unfair to label someone for having problems or for a doctor to refuse medications that would enable someone to lead a relativaly normal life. I have now come to terms with the fact that I will most probably be on this medication for the rest of my life(how ever long that may be) and am fortunate enough to have an understanding GP, as long as I show no problems then I only have to see them and not any phsiciatrists.
     
  11. AntiAimer

    AntiAimer Newbie

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    Remember one thing, medicines prevent and have the potential to cure. Drugs are just that and will only mask the problems.
     
  12. Politicalchalk

    Politicalchalk Titanium Member

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    This is a kind of post where we must remember our critical thinking skills.

    Medical science, when evaluating if a treatment is effective for an illness, has only one question: "Does it work?"

    If you go to a doctor and say "I have the following problems. It is related to my such-and-such illness." -- than the doctor will respond with something like "Aha! You have this. I cure you!" Now, obviously that's over-simplified, but in essence, a doctor's duty is to diagnose, treat, and improve the quality of life(...within ethical means). One supposes that, if one is offered a script for it, than the doctor (assuming he's not a lousy diagnostician) who Rxed it was trying to fix that which you presented with. Treatment doesn't work? Keep rotating until something does work. And by work, we mean "cure," to the best of his abilities.

    I guess I just don't see why you'd go to a doctor...and not take his advice. In America anyways. It's really a different story if you don't have to directly pay for it. Granted, sometimes you need to shop around a little.

    Having mental problems myself (bipolar), I guess I just can't understand any of this anti-psychiatry rubbish. A clockwork orange...there's soooo many other factors at play there, not simply pill popping.

    Remember, the doctor who treats himself has a fool for a patient.
     
  13. Euthanatos93420

    Euthanatos93420 Silver Member

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    Right the fuck on akewstick. Let consciousness exist as it may. Be as for I am I for he said "I am who I am" and now we are US. On the note I would like me to mention that US should not sell itself to england for the sake of wealth Remember what Samuel Adams said:

    "If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."

    And Jesus said...eye of needle...camel...rich men to heaven...etc.

    We don't need no Education. We don't need no....THOUGHT CONTROL.

    Fuck the blue pills (Xanax, Valium, abilify, Risperdol...etc. notice a pattern people? The made the new valiums and vics pink...sneaky lying Pharmy bastards). I don't want to forget. I want to be of whole mind and Whole (Holy) Spirit. Give me the real red pill TYVM!!!!! (Does anyone notice how damn much that thing looks like a RoboGel!?!?!)))

    They say schitzophrenia is a "Split Mind" but how is that different in defenition from BiPolar or MPD? (IK manifest symptoms...I have been through the systems and seen it all...he knows the difference between disorders and is not trying to skew them but show how they are aspects of the same lie). Split mind, or an ego that divides concsiousness and unconsciousness (Jungian....read it....it's called a ficking library...torrent...or google for christs sake....you dont need to pay for truth that is otherwise free just so you can run on their system's treadmill and make what is essentially a political machina for you shall find in it no Deus. Nay Relenquish to Kaos thy faith and allow that which is meaningless to be hallow (/& hollow) and be filled with what can only be divine meaning. For since consciousness is unquantifiable (Unmeasurable) it is necessarily universal.

    Most paranoid schitzophrenics I know tend to know more about what is really going on than most normal people.

    "In an insane society, the sole sane person will necessarily be [percieved as and therefore] insane."

    - Carl Jung

    I wonder sometimes if a schitzophrenic's hallucinations are the brain lacking ego stability and letting holes appear in what is essentially a barrier all 'sane' people have decidedly ignored. The hallucinations are a semi-metaphorical representation to the schizophrenic what all of us would see and do see but the difference is that a 'sane' person's ego efficiently blocks out this undesirable content.

    Even when we ignore these demons which are present in our mind (Fear, anger etc. over trauma long ago repressed + any association that reminds US of this trauma repressed and compounded (Bottle your emotions, traumatic repression, etc.) they do not truly leave our mind but our hidden from our waking conciousness yet still determine who we are and what our consciousness is. While we hide it from ourselves when we hide what is all too obvious to others from ourselves we give other both control and responsibility for our minds since they can easily see how to 'push our buttons' like a remote fucking control. Like a fucking robot and here we are looking for a literal Deus Ex Machina. Since we cannot deal with this we hand control over to someone else. Government, from the Greek, literrally, To control the mind.

    We don't need no...education

    Besides....it's only HIS STORY. The truth is out there. If knowledge passes through consciousness and consciousness is universal then time is irrelivant and knowledge is infinate. The quest for the truth isn't about finding the right answers. It's about asking the right questions because any good test taker will tell you that their favorite secret isn't a secret at all. More often than not the answer is inherent in the question (When the question is original and genuine).

    My Favorite Example (Hints not so subtley included!)

    What is the MEANING of life???

    BTW!

    "Can you....TRIP LIKE I DO!?!?!??!!?!?" - Crystal Method
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2008
  14. Politicalchalk

    Politicalchalk Titanium Member

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    Wow, euthanatos, sounds like you've been studying your psychology! Your mind is vast and expansive and I welcome your consciousness into mine. :)

    Schizophrenia literally in greek means "Split mind" -- today there are so many different manifestations and sub-diagnoses, etc, that it's more of a blanket term. The early greek doctors needed to call all the crazy people *something, to differentiate the mentals from the general population. Socrates kinda poisoned society (no pun intended!) by calling for Reason to be the most significant human faculty. If they couldn't explain a person's actions by reason, that is, pure reason alone, than that person must be "sick." But I digress -- I could rant about Socrates and his malfecense all day.

    "Fuck the blue pills...give me the red ones!" Color is quite irrelevant (unless you're allergic to tartrazine) to the pill, it's the content. Swim's bipolar. If he misses even ONE day of his meds, his friends, family, and even parents get pissed because Swim won't shut up. "Swim, that's the 8th time you've told me that today!" -- not bad at first, but quite annoying by the end of the day. He'll be ape-shit manic and won't sleep for a few days (unless he sedates himself-- not just a little, but into oblivion), and the overall quality of life...while it seems fun at first, takes a toll on the body. The cat even had one experience with psychosis, running down the street nude thinking his best friends were going to kill him, called grandma to the local pizza shop at midnight to pick him up screaming and crying. At 22. Even the early greeks recommended drinking from the lithium springs to help with mental illness in general. But to say to just let consciousness flow as it would, well, that might be the idea with "normies," and mental illness is highly over-diagnosed these days. But if you need it, you need it. Besides, wouldn't letting pure consciousness flow be analogous to NO psychoactive drug use, even the recreational?

    You seems to like quotes. I am reminded of a story that his Sensai taught him (teacher -- not necissarily karate. I am a buddhist.) It was about how consciousness is the same for each and every sentient being. The goal in this life is to attain enlightenment, to become one with the "higher" consciousness that connects us all. Once a man with mental problems came to the temple. The master of the temple hadn't realized the man's illness, and was trying all the traditional means to help him on his path. Eventually, the master figures it out. He immediately sends the man to work, to clean the temple. He would sweep the floor, over and over...eventually, he swept in perfect circles. He was calmed by the repition and the shape and manner of his sweeping helped him to focus. So even those with mental illness have the potential to attain enlightenment, their consciousness is our consciousness.

    "Meds are an attempt at deus ex machina." I see your point, and there is some truth to that...but traditionally, "god out of machine" comes when the story is soooo far gone, and the hero seems hopelessly trapped, that some *thing* (machine) comes and just makes it all better. Meds are not a cure-all, but a treatment. Nice phraseolaogy though, your intellect is strong. "The force is strong in this one!"

    There is a debate in psychology about schizophrenia, how it ought be classified. My psych teacher once told me that some people think the schizos are MORE sane because their mind has developed it's own methods for dealing with reality. To wrap up, it should also be noted that meds are very very different from one another. Viagara (tadalafil? not exatly sure of it's generic, it's the boner-pill) is not psychoactive, and if yer 75 you'd probably be pretty thankful for it. Valium is a psych med, but widely prescribed for it's variety of uses, a so-called "minor tranquilizer" -- as opposed to anti-psychotics like Risperidone, which is a harsh tranquilizer. The long term effects of all these meds are different, and Swim thinks, while he sees your point, that it is unfair and inaccurate to classify meds all the same. Some meds bring people to a more 'normal' state (whatever that means), whereas some meds turn people into zombies and basket weavers who sit and smile and twiddle their tumbs and toes.

    BTW, there's a legal debate going on about wether a person can be compelled to take psych meds or not. The classic scenario is a man who is psychotic unless he takes his meds, in which case he leads a normal, healthy life. He runs out of meds and, before he can get the script filled the next day, kills an innocent person. Should be be forcibly given meds to make him "fit to stand trial?" It varies from state to state, and they tend to side with the patient, that is, you shouldn't be forced to take meds. The state intervenes when it becomes a matter of public safety....in theory anyways.

    Swim's enjoying the conversation, lots of great input!
    ------
    Euthanatos --- did you come up with that, study greek, or just hear it and have it stick? I like it in any event!
     
  15. xanthracks

    xanthracks Newbie

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    That is BULLSHOT I didnot get fat because of a change in my personal eating habits or I JUST GOT LAZY BULL F***ING SHOT thats the same spooful of donkey SHOT my quack dock tried to brainwash me.

    I am on a healthwatch due to another doc prescribing me dex-amphetimines; causing me to overtime suffer delusions, and the sorts. I just recently got of the risperidal injection.

    Ripsperidal not only caused permanent damage; annurism/clot in the brain constant headaches everyday; feeling sluggish and confused at work, IT MADE ME FAT.

    At this point in time I am feeling like I have an extra 'fuzz' on my eyes, and I now take my pills not a injection medecation, There is a direct connection of weightgain to Risperidone. I was for years only 140 lbs I am now 200 lbs without a change in diet or exercise activity.