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Combinations - Chlordiazepoxide as a potentiator for MS Contin?

Discussion in 'Morphine' started by beena, May 13, 2008.

  1. beena

    beena Palladium Member

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    38 y/o Female from U.K.
    SWIM usually takes between 450mg and 600mg of MS Contin of a night recreationally. This is a lot and SWIM would like to take less but she has such a high tolerance to them that she has to take a high dosage just to get high. Some 5mg chlordiazepoxide tablets (librium) have come into her possession and she read on this site somewhere that they can act as a potentiator for morphine. Is this right? If so, how many chlordiazepoxide should she take? and by how much should she reduce her usual take of MS Contin by? Should she take the librium before the morphine? Basically SWIM would just like as much information as possible about taking these drugs before she does it. Thankyou.
     
  2. darkbreed

    darkbreed Newbie

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    All benzos potentiates the effects of opiates and other CNS suppressant drugs (most at least as far SWIM knows).

    5mg is the lowest strength of librium (chlordiazepoxide) available, SWIM just got a bunch of 25mg ones himself.

    So, starting low would be a good idea, I would start with half of the dose I normally need for recreational use of the opiate with one of the 5mg tablets and see, then perhaps increase with a couple more of both an hour or so later if the effects are not satisfying.

    With that said, SWIM has no experience with chlordiazepoxide himself, he just got his first 60 tablets of 25mg each today along with his first bunch of ketazolam (30mg each) which he will be testing out the coming days in different ways.
     
  3. y0ssarianlives

    y0ssarianlives Titanium Member

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    SWIM hates to say this, but morphine absorbs only 33% through oral use. IV use is 100%. Thats quite a bit of morphine you save. 200MG injected would be the same as eating 600 but SWIY also get the inredible rush and immediate effects from it by IV'ing. Although unless SWIY has IV'ed before, SWIM would not recommend taking that step.
     
  4. darkbreed

    darkbreed Newbie

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    Do you know the % of absorption through the rectal route? Or let it absorb in the mouth under the tounge? I assume you are referring to swallowing down the pill.
     
  5. y0ssarianlives

    y0ssarianlives Titanium Member

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    Rectal is comparable to oral. Sublingual is less than oral.
     
  6. darkbreed

    darkbreed Newbie

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    No I am 99% sure rectal is more absorbant than oral, thus why rectal administrations are often performed in hospitals etc even if the patient can eat the pill.

    I've read different things, from 200-250% more absorbant and quicker effect than oral as it has less stuff to get through to get into the blood (sorry for my bad explanation I'm no doctor).

    Sublingual would be more than oral in SWIMs experience, faster onset, more powerful effecs.

    SWIM have tried all three methods himself and found the rectal route most potent, the sublingual the second most potent and the oral down in belly least potent in most cases (some benzos taste so bad you really dont have a choice to either swallow it or put it up the butter).

    Of course, IV administration is even more powerful when the substance is readily available for IV use in liquid form, such as liquid diazepam ampuls or liquid midazolam ampuls etc.

    But from SWIMs experience, of the routes he tried, the rectal one seem to be the most effective beside from IV. Anyone else noticed this? And got some more info on it regarding absorbation etc?
     
  7. y0ssarianlives

    y0ssarianlives Titanium Member

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    MORPHINE HYDROCHLORIDE mixture Rectal, Sublingual A small volume of mixture is usually more practical. Rectal dose is comparable to oral.9 Sublingual bioavailability of morphine is less than oral.(10)
    9. Breda, M., Bianchi, M. Et al. Plasma morphine and morphine-6-glucuronide patterns in cancer patients after oral, subcuaneous, sublabial and rectal short-term administration Int. J. Clin.Pharmacol. Res.(Switzerland) 1991, 11 (2), 93-97.
    10. Weinber, D.S., Inturrisi, C.E. et al. Sublingual absorption of selected opioid analgesics. Clin. Pharmacol. Ther. Sep. 1988 44(3), 335-42.
     
  8. darkbreed

    darkbreed Newbie

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    Dental treatment in children who are too young or too apprehensive to cooperate is often performed under sedation. In Sweden, the tradition has been to administer sedatives rectally in small children, but oral liquid sedation is now increasingly used.
    Aim: To compare the sedative effects of oral and rectal administration of midazolam in children undergoing dental treatment under general anaesthesia and to assess acceptance of sedative administration, acceptance of application of the facemask, and amnesia. Methods: Fifty children aged 2–7 y were randomly allocated to receive either liquid oral or rectal sedation, with 25 children in each group. Results: The sedative effect of rectal administration was higher, but not statistically significantly, than that of oral administration (p = 0.07). No significant differences in acceptance of sedative administration, acceptance of mask application or amnesia were found between the groups.
    Conclusion: Both the oral and the rectal routes can in most cases be appropriate. However, the better sedative effect of rectal administration of midazolam makes it a more favourable route in pre-cooperative and non-compliant children.



    http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1651-2227.2002.tb02856.x

    darkbreed added 8 Minutes and 0 Seconds later...

    [FONT=arial,helvetica,verdana][FONT=arial,helvetica,verdana][FONT=arial,helvetica,verdana]Following oral administration Benzodiazepines are well absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract, usually within 1 to 2 hours. Following intramuscular administration _ Lorazepam absorption is rapid and complete, whereas chlordiazepoxide and diazepam absorption may be slow and erratic, depending upon the site of administration . When diazepam is injected into the deltoid muscle, absorption is usually rapid and complete . Following rectal administration _ Absorption of diazepam rectal solution and rectal gel is rapid.

    http://www.mongabay.com/health/medications/Alprazolam.html
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2017
  9. Ididnotinhale

    Ididnotinhale Newbie

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    Swim is almost idential to swiy. He needs about 600mg of ms-contin to get high (internasally) and has a script for Klonopin.

    Librium will definetly help swiy nod, but may not help to feel that much more opiated. Librium should help, but it is not a miracle.

    Swim would suggest using 15mg of librium and decrease the opiate amount by 20 to 30%. Play around with dosages until swiy finds out what works best for her.

    Be careful with librium because benzos greatly increase the chances of OD.

    Swim would suggest saving up swiy's librium and using them to decrease the pain of WD if swim's source goes dry. (which will happen in time)

    hope that helps
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2008
  10. y0ssarianlives

    y0ssarianlives Titanium Member

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    SWIM suggests not trying this alone for the first few times either. Please be safe.