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Side effects - DMT: Brain damage?

Discussion in 'DMT and Ayahuasca' started by The Last Man, Jun 3, 2009.

  1. The Last Man

    The Last Man Newbie

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    I'm looking for scientific sources verifying whether or not DMT can cause any kind of brain damage, particularly, cognitive damage. Any other information about the safety of DMT would be welcome.
     
  2. Desertfox

    Desertfox Palladium Member

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    Well firstly DMT occurs endogenously inside our brains, therefore our bodies have been metabolizing this molecule our entire lives whether or not we were aware of it. This is also a big reason why Smoked dmt is so short in duration is because the molecule used up by the body very quickly relative to similar psychoactives, because our bodies are used to handling it. And this is also why it is rather safe and no cases of brain damage have been reported in any scientific literature that SWIM has ever read. DMT is quite special because it is so similar in structure to our other neurotransmitters, it has the most intense psychedelic effects but also the shortest-acting. SWIM is aware of difficult experiences that were left unintergrated into a persons normal waking life based off of what was encountered on that persons trip, but SWIM has never found anything to suggest it can cause any sort of neuronal/brain/cognitive damage whatsoever.

    Here's a science article about Endogenous DMT...
    http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&catid=53&id=6750


    It may even play a role in our normal waking sensory perception...
    http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&catid=53&id=6161
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2009
  3. The Last Man

    The Last Man Newbie

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    That's quite elucidating, thank you. I have another question, but I'll post it in a new thread because it's unrelated to this.
     
  4. Sublimit

    Sublimit Silver Member

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    And if the band you're in starts playing different tunes, i'll see you on the dark side of the moon! i wonder if Syd did a bit of DMT back in the day? or was it just acid back then. wonder if DMT was accessible in those glorious late 60's and even better 70's music wise

    Sublimit added 996 Minutes and 5 Seconds later...

    Sorry about that, the thread title gave me a bit of nostalgia, and made me wonder about how accessible DMT would have been in the 60s and 70s. i guess that i should of made my own thread about that. Anyway,

    from SWIM's and his puppy's experience, which has been quite extensive... NO... instead of feeling mentally exhausted like after an LSD trip SWIM feels like his brain has been enhanced in a way, massaged. Being naturally produced in our own brains, i cant seeing it causing brain damage when smoking it. however, if taken with an inhibitor and orally the duration of the DMT trip may last as long as an LSD trip and may cause you feeling exhausted at the end of it. ????

    Sorry SWIM can't help more, he's still yet to do a proper Ayahuasca, but in SWIM's and his puppy's experience with smoking it, no it doesn't cause brain damage. However, if SWIY plans on using an inhibitor like Syrian rue, then be very mindful of the risk of serotonin syndrome, and yes that will cause brain damage
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2009
  5. The Last Man

    The Last Man Newbie

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    Hm, I'd still prefer to use it orally with a MAOI. Half an hour is a little short a time to come to profound psychological insights, and I heard smoking it is very irritating (and possibly very harmful) to the lungs. What is the easiest-to-use MAOI, and is there an easier way to use ayahuasca than by brewing it? I'm really unpractical, I already have great difficulties peeling San Pedro.
     
  6. Sublimit

    Sublimit Silver Member

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    SWIM only knows of Syrian rue to use as a MAOI, as he lives in Australia and thats the easiest thing to get. tastes awful and SWIY needs to eat a couple of grams of it (off the top of my head). I'm sure you're well aware that you have to be very mindful of anything that's already in your system, certain foods, certain drinks can have devastating results as i'm sure you know. i cant tell you anything about ayahuasca, only that someday SWIM will travel and experience it in its true form/setting.

    I really do think SWIY underestimates the effects of smoking pure DMT crystal using the proper method(not an ice pipe) or smoking DMT infused leaf through a hash pipe, or even a bong! it can be quite harsh depending on the method of smoking it, but SWIM and his droog have got it down to a fine art where swim can take a massive hit, a breakthrough with ease. by the sounds of it SWIY hasn't had much experience with smoking it? If you smoke a decent amount you will trip and in the space of about 5 mins you'll seem to have all the time in the world to witness these "profound psychological insights" remembering them can sometimes be hard though. If one had the courage and desire, one could easily break-through and have a complete out of body experience, and thats something one will never forget.

    SWIM had some amazing experiences with smoking it. SWIM likes to go far but not enough to breakthrough and leave SWIMs body. You could be seeing the most complex visualisations and have time to see it all developing from every aspect, millions of thoughts that can be heard, stare at it's awesomeness, let go and it will take you on a roller-coaster ride of what would seem to be impossible to take in. Words don't do it justice.
     
  7. The Last Man

    The Last Man Newbie

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    Yes, I've heard that smoking ayahuasca is extremely and sometimes overwhelmingly powerful. But if the experience is spread over several hours rather than minutes, maybe you have more time to calm down enough to make some sense of all the things you experience?

    Anyway, I couldn't deal with such an intense experience on such a short time. I invariably need time to accustom myself to the altered state of consciousness.
     
  8. Sublimit

    Sublimit Silver Member

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    Don't be so sure, from SWIM's experience he had no choice "to deal with such an intense experience" and for me, thats what DMT can be about, losing control and letting go. If SWIY smokes enough he might experience an ego death, which is sort of like a generic term considering infinity AKA DMT. it's kind of complicated to explain, but if SWIY puts himself out there and experimented with smoking small amounts using the right equipment, then he has a lot to be intrigued by without being scared. IMO i reckon SWIY should try smoking DMT before ingesting with a MAOI... you've got nothing to lose, and remember the risks of taking an inhibitor with an oral dose, SWIM has smoked DMT maybe a 100 times. SWIM's still reluctant to do a MAOI + DMT dose, and neither are his droogs.

    Sorry if i'm going on a bit, but i really think you should get a feel for it first and respect it's power. The best way iMO would be to smoke small amounts ant then progress from there.

    to summarise, if SWIY were to take a decent hit of smoked DMT he would have no choice but to accept this amazing altered state of reality. Yeah obviously it's full on and intense but the bottom line is that it's safe, it may take you 30 seconds to a minute to get over the fear, but once you've been there, you learn to let go and embrace every second of it.

    One last thing..... Time seems to stand still the second you rip that pipe, time doesn't exist depending on how much one smokes.

    You also mentioned the short term effects of smoking DM would detract from the overall experience. Well let me put it this way, you spend around 5 mins tripping balls, and then for the next 15- 20 minutes you sit/lay there and reminisce over the impossibility you lust witnessed, you'll find yourself uncontrollably laughing about what SWIY just witnessed.

    Oh and just to clarify, you can't consider ayahuasca DMT... I highly doubt one could smoke an ayahuasca brew meant for ingestion
     
  9. The Last Man

    The Last Man Newbie

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    Aha, so you can only smoke pure DMT… I'll consider it when I'm a more experienced oneironaut, though as I never smoked anything else, I'm a bit concerned that lung pain may spoil the experience. I've no idea where to get pure DMT, though.