Culture - If you get caught with Research Chemicals

Discussion in 'Research Chemicals' started by Toltec, Oct 21, 2005.

  1. Toltec

    Toltec Gold Member

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    "In essence, to be on the safe side, you should consider Research Chemicals to be just as illegal as any scheduled substance. Although your chances of getting prosecuted are lower than for scheduled substances, it can and does happen.


    IMPORTANT: If you are busted with RCs, do NOT tell the police what the substance is. I have heard of cases where people got busted with an RC, and they told the police what the substance was, trying to explain that the substance was legal. This is a BIG MISTAKE. First of all, the police aren’t going to believe you when you claim it is legal. Second, you are making it easier for them to figure out what the substance is. THEREFORE DO NOT SAY ANYTHING AT ALL, AND SIMPLY ASK FOR A LAWYER.


    There is a decent chance that the police will not know what the drug is, and will not go to great lengths to figure it out. They may do presumptive tests for cocaine, meth, heroin or other scheduled drugs, and when they realize it isn’t a scheduled substance, they may decide not to pursue charges. It takes money and resources to do something like MS/GC analysis, and they may not bother to go this far. Even then, they may not be able to figure out or prove what the drug is; they will have to bring in expert witnesses to testify about it, and so on.


    SO KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT AND FORCE THEM TO FIGURE IT OUT. You’re most likely not going to talk your way out of it, so don’t even try."


    Food for thought!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 19, 2010
    1. 3/5,
      rational, logical
      Oct 10, 2009
    2. 3/5,
      good advice
      Mar 15, 2009
    3. 5/5,
      some of the best law advice I've seen.
      Mar 11, 2009
    4. 3/5,
      really good information to know. Its a good thing to keep in mind.
      Mar 10, 2009
    5. 3/5,
      Very Good Advice
      Mar 4, 2009
    6. 3/5,
      Good post yes keep your mouth shut but be polite
      Feb 9, 2009
    7. 3/5,
      good post very helpful info :D
      Dec 1, 2007
    8. 4/5,
      Excellent advice, thanks for sharing.
      May 16, 2007
  2. Solidly-here

    Solidly-here Gold Member

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    Sometimes it's good to talk to the police.


    If a particular Research Chemical is not Scheduled, a person can lawfully possess it (but not for the express purpose of Tripping on it). If I had a Gram of 4-HO-DiPT, and for some reason a cop found it on me, I could refuse to talk about it. If I Shut Up, the cop will assume that this "funny" white powder is Coke (or something else Schedule One). On that basis he will want to arrest me, give me a free ride to the station, and then test my Chemical thereat the station.


    It is my suggestion to state what the Chemical is (but NOT to say what I plan to do with it). This gives a person the "chance" that he will not be taken in, this will save you from getting to witness the cop performing all of the Chemical tests.


    Also, with 4-HO-DiPT, it will give a False-Positive for Cocaine; I know a SWIM who had this experience; he refused to talk about the baggie. After bailing out for $10,000, the Full Test was done. A month later, in Court, the case for Possession of Cocaine was dismissed (or actually, Not Charged by the DA).


    If the Research Chemical is Schedule One, it would be better to NOT talk. You could always claim that it was someone else's later (after talking to an attorney). And, in California, we have Proposition 36: The first time you get arrested for possession of ANY drug, you can go to a few classes, and then have the case dismissed. But, still, it's better to remain silent.
     
  3. Nagognog2

    Nagognog2 Iridium Member

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    Those cop test-kits for cocaine consist of a solution of cobalt thiocyanate. If it turns blue, Porky is to think it's coke. I got news for you: Cobalt Thiocyanate will turn blue with most things - including lead paint, acrylic resins, laundry detergent...get the picture?


    I would tell Porky that what I have is not illegal. I'd rattle off it's chemical name so fast his head would spin, and tell him if he destroys my private property - that my attornies would be all over him like an under-fed Rottweiler. If he wanted to know whatit's for, he'd get the same answer I always give when they demand my Social Security number: None of your business.


    But that's just me.
     
  4. snapper

    snapper Gold Member

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    Actually, even better, find your favorite neutraceutical or smart drug, and
    indicate that, as far as you know, the product is just piracetam or
    something along those lines. If they do GC or NMR, you are in trouble
    anyway, but you can always fein ignorance when they confront you about
    the misidentification -
    Saw that one on cops once - guy got pulled over with a baggie of
    something and said is was some kind of bodybuilding supplement
    (androstenediol or something along those lines..).
    They tested it and let him go..

    Snapper
     
  5. Pinkavvy

    Pinkavvy Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Toltec - you are right.

    Per swims attorney, who specializes in RCs, it is best to say nothing at all. I have had a very close friend get busted with 2c-i, and what saved her in the end is that she was charged with possession with intent to distribute something that it wasn't ... when swim and firneds lawyer handed lab test results to the prosecuting attorney with a brief of it's legality, the charges were dropped instantly. (that is 3 months after arrest. no she wasn't in jail the 3 months either, a simple 12 hours after arrest she was released awaiting pre-trial motion court hearing.)

    If you tell a pig what it is and that it is legal, they will not believe you plain and simple. So in addition to getting arrested (which will happen either way) you are also telling them what it is and what to test for. Next, the prosecuter just has to show that you are intending it as an ANALOG or even worse just show that it's effects are similar enough to a scheduled substance to be an analog.

    The best advice, when caught with any drug, including grey-area legal unscheduled RC's, is to shut the fuck up and grin when they arrest you for possesion of an scheduled substance. Being arrested for a scheduled substance, when it is infact not a scheduled substance, and then not saying anything, is your best chance to get off.

    If you can't afford an attourney that specializes in RCs, make sure you have information to give to your lawyer. Most non-specific defence lawyer do not know what RC's are. Tell your lawyer what it is, that it is legal, and send them to erowid for information.

    Swim recomends to all that play with rc's at a level bigger than 1 gram a year, to put a retainer on one of the RC-Savvy lawyers listed in the law forum.
     
    1. 4/5,
      Great advice, thanks.
      May 16, 2007
  6. oldman

    oldman Gold Member

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    I agree with pink and toltec, having been arrested for possession and talking to cops is what turned me into an oldman before my time. They acted like they were going to be cool and try to help me out for being cooperative but it was pure B.S.


    The D.A. was willing to plea it down to a disorderly conduct $100 fineand the prosecuting or officer that charged me refused to go along with that, saying he thought there was more going on than I wass telling him. pig fucker, he was wrong. his gut insinct cost me a whole lotta money and headache and will continue to do so for years to come.


    My lawyer's best advice was that under NO circumstances whatsoever do you ever talk to a cop, unless in need of serious medical attention, and then only maybe.I was naive and well stupid to the ways of the law. That cop lied at the arrainment about things I had said. My lawyer said that it didn't matter, he was a cop, sworn to uphold the law and without a burden of proof, his testimony would prevail in court. Don't provoke them and don't give them anything they could possibly construe to use against you. Call a freakin lawyer. I keep mine's number (home, vacation home, and office)programmed on my phone.
     
    1. 4/5,
      Vry good and true advice about cops telling lies!!
      Nov 25, 2009
  7. blindpanda_eric

    blindpanda_eric Silver Member

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    This goes with "Know Your Substance." You should really always
    know when something is going to test positive for a scheduled
    substance. (I'm sure this info is available somewhere)
     
  8. acolon_5

    acolon_5 Gold Member

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    That is the best advise I have ever heard. Tell them nothing. No cop in his/her right mind will just take your word for it that it is legal. You will be going for a ride, and the less they know the better. It is a lot better to have to spend a few hours in a holding cell than 2-3 years on probation with p tests. Do what you will, but neither swim or I would ever give poliece information about anything, anytime, anyplace, for any reason (except the obvious reasons, fire, someone is in danger...etc)
     
  9. nanobrain

    nanobrain Platinum Member

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    tell nothing. that said field tests now show false positive for many legal Research Chemicals - search microgram bullletins, there's plenty of info on forensic ID.

    go around your house and marquis / mandelin / robadope random powders and stashes, you'll be surprised @ what you discover.

    never have doses which in any way may be attributed to intent to consume / distribut for same. get a good lawyer.

    get a relevant degree, a real business and a legitimate research porpoise. or monkey ;-)

    a GC/MS + HPLC multi-column array rigged to an NMR plus a handy Cray superstack may either arouse or allay LE suspicion.

    Branded lab coats are handy as proof, as are Large Hadron Supercolliders.Edited by: nanobrain
     
  10. oldman

    oldman Gold Member

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    what would be considered relevent research?


    it specifically says research may not be conducted on any human, animal, plant,....that kinda narrows it down a little so "everybodydon't bother with the monkey business" lol.


    I work with animals and figure that research on them would not bedeemed appropriate by authorities. I don't like that anyway.
     
  11. Pinkavvy

    Pinkavvy Platinum Member & Advisor

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    I use chemicals in his ongoing research to find a compound that safely keeps ants away from sugars.

    It's a shame that swip keeps accidentally running across swims chemicals and confuses it with sugar. stupid swip.
    Edited by: pinkavvy
     
  12. XtomX

    XtomX Newbie

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    I live in Australia and had the cops find 4-ho-dipt, 2c-e and BZP/tmfpp in my room. I told them what it was, they didn't belive me and tried to tell me it was H or something. Havent heard anything from them since (that was 4 months ago)
     
  13. snapper

    snapper Gold Member

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    I think that unless the product is scheduled, it would be not worth the
    prosecution, at least in the US. There have been few if any documented
    prosecution for Research Chemical use or possession yet, and this will probably continue
    until all are scheduled. It is very difficult to prove use, and the FDA wants
    to keep that pandora's box we call the analog act closed since it will
    create a HUGE problem for the pharm industry. Best to not talk to cops -
    when they figure out they have no controlled substance, they are likely to
    give up.
    Even when they busted all the Research Chemical vendors here, clients were not
    aggressively pursued except to be witnesses.

    Snapper
     
  14. moracca

    moracca Silver Member

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    hahaha I just had the funniest image in my head of a cop dabbing his finger into a baggie of unmarked Research Chemicals and tasting it to see if it's cocaine. That might make the whole experience worth while :p
     
  15. astenu

    astenu Silver Member

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    I think a small quantity might get you a warning if no other drugs or paraphenalia were found on your person. but more than a couple of grams may get you a free ride to the local jail. i have a hunch they may suspect you are intending to distribute it and are planng to pass it off as a controlled substance on the street
     
  16. Pino

    Pino Gold Member

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    Re: If you get caught with RCs

    This is also a fine advice for the Netherlands and maybe for more countries in Europe too. It is forbidden just to confiscate your property here. Swim clearly scribes on packages what is in it. He doesn't state where it is used for and he keeps it in a safe. One has to officially take distance from your private property. They can force you of course, but it will be difficult. Also one has to ask the officers name and id number. Really handy, if the gentleman starts to act a bit rude. Swim really doesn't like that behaviour. He is attitude to his best friends can be best described as beyond gentle. He would like to see some gentleness in return.
     
  17. Winta

    Winta Newbie

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    Re: If you get caught with RCs

    This might be a good advice arround the world, but really isnt all that great in denmark, since the police here is too lazy to do shit if they can avoid it :) (or they are just beeing fair?)

    Anyway SWIM and some of his friends tried this; The police stopped them with some Methylone, actually quite a lot of methylone, and when SWIM told them what it was, they said ok, and let SWIM keep it, another time they took it, but it came back to SWIM, a friend of SWIM also had it taken together with some clean mdma, he got a fine for the mdma but got the methylone back.
     
  18. EyesOfTheWorld

    EyesOfTheWorld Silver Member R.I.P.

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    Re: If you get caught with RCs


    SWIM heard an anecdotal story (this may or may not be true) that a bus full of hippie-types headed for a Dead show was pulled over by 2 LE's, and thoroughly searched under the usual bullshit "I smell marijuana" "probable cause" that they love to use whenever a vehicle full of obvious degenerates is pulled over. Anyway, a thorough search was conducted, no marijuana was found, but a gram (or half gram, cannot remember through the haze of years since swim heard this story) of crystal LSD was found. Of course, the LE's began to ask is it crack, meth, etc? No one gave answers, so the 2 LE's did the taste test, good fingerprint sized taste tests, and remarked that it was not coke or meth but was obviously some sort of drugs so it would have to be tested. Hereupon, the busload realizes that if they can just keep the pigs occupied for 20 minutes or so, they can probably escape, so they start bullshitting with them, some telling jokes, some being belligerent, some playing Mr. Niceguy (basically our side's version of "Good Cop, Bad Cop"....anyway, bullshittery continues for about 20-30 minutes until both Porkies complain of feeling "sick" and decide to go to their cruiser "for air" and to test the drug. They did not make it to the cruiser, as they decided to crawl around on the ground outside and eat dirt, grass and rocks. The bus got the fuck outta Dodge and the cops didn't notice or care.
     
    1. 3/5,
      The visuals on that story amazing. Good post made my day.
      Feb 9, 2009
    2. 4/5,
      I hope that's true
      Feb 6, 2009
  19. dslexic1

    dslexic1 Newbie

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    Re: If you get caught with RCs

    I got arrested once for.counterkpsdgm... anyway when he was asked to step out of the car he let his folded up piece's of paper containing dom, and dpt gently fall to the ground unnoticed. Well they found it eventually. While he was sitting in the back of the cruiser enjoying the cops frustration trying to figure out what the substance's was, one of the officers came and asked in such a nice and freindly manner, "is this your heroin?" swim replied it wasnt his and the cop told him that they tested it and it has heroin on it. Eventually after admitting to nothing they left swim alone. Mysteriously when I was bonded out he had 200mgs of Dom and 500mg of DPT in his property bag. Swim realizes the DOM was schedule one and the DPT is 100% legal. So keeping his mouth shut prolly saved him from yet another charge. Is this your heroin? WTF first base is tha other way buddy. Cops and their advanced psychological tactics.
     
  20. scored

    scored Silver Member

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    It would be interesting to hear if anyone busted with 'legal' RC's had them returned.

    On reflection perhaps NOT making a human rights campaign out of getting You 'legal' drugs back. At the moment it seems grey for a lot of RC's. I am going to enjoy it while it lasts.

    scored added 29 Minutes and 23 Seconds later...

    Best to answer this when your wearing your stripey jumper, eye mask and large bag with a large sign that says swag.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2009