1. Dear Drugs-Forum readers: We are a small non-profit that runs one of the most read drug information & addiction help websites in the world. We serve over 4 million readers per month, and have costs like all popular websites: servers, hosting, licenses and software. To protect our independence we do not run ads. We take no government funds. We run on donations which average $25. If everyone reading this would donate $5 then this fund raiser would be done in an hour. If Drugs-Forum is useful to you, take one minute to keep it online another year by donating whatever you can today. Donations are currently not sufficient to pay our bills and keep the site up. Your help is most welcome. Thank you.
    PLEASE HELP
    Dismiss Notice

Injecting - Injecting Basics, dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

Discussion in 'Opiates & Opioids' started by Forthesevenlakes, Feb 10, 2007.

  1. Forthesevenlakes

    Forthesevenlakes Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    1,481
    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    2,015
    Male
    Hello everybody!

    ("Hi, Dr. Nick!")

    SWIM is compiling information for a sticky thread in the opiates section about the risks, dangers, and things to avoid when shooting pills. There has been alot of requests for information lately along the lines of if percocet or other APAP (tylenol) containing pills are safe to inject with a CWE. To SWIM's knowledge there is no completely safe way to do this. SWIM has been looking for information on the ACTUAL dangers associated with shooting acetaminophen, but is having some trouble finding any on the internet.

    So, if anyone out there can provide some good info on why, exactly, IVing a pill with acetaminophen is dangerous, please post it here!

    Also, SWIM is digging up info on why IVing pills is dangerous, so any information about that should be posted too.

    Thanks for your help, hopefully we can make this into a good resource that will help minimize harm when using IV drugs.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 26, 2007
  2. Forthesevenlakes

    Forthesevenlakes Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    1,481
    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    2,015
    Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use

    To start with, here's part of a case study that deals with an individual who was injecting hydrocodone and codeine containing pills with acetaminophen in it. This person was not using a cold water extraction (CWE) to remove the acetaminophen. Keep in mind this is a case study, and may not represent the most common dangers of injecting pills, but it is useful in that it shows some potential dangers of injecting without attempting to remove acetaminophen as well as other binders in pills. The full case study can be found here.

    " Clinically, individuals who crush oral medications and inject them intravenously (or through a central port, as in this case) can develop a multinodular pattern on chest radiograph and chest CT that can be associated with a progressive decline in PFTs. Repeated insults can lead to dyspnea, pulmonary hypertension, and death. Proving this diagnosis may be a challenge in a patient who is legitimately prescribed narcotics for pain but adamantly denies intravenous drug abuse. Although crystalline material has been reported from precipitation of total parenteral nutrition fluid components, recognition of characteristic histologic features of oral-tablet constituents such as microcrystalline cellulose and povidone on a lung biopsy specimen leads to a definitive diagnosis."
     
  3. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use

    Here is what is required for a safe IV. You can't correctly prepare apap for IV by yourself just like you can't put keif in a spoon and slam it. Look further down for Phlebitis


    Intravenous drip

    An intravenous drip is the continuous infusion of fluids, with or without medications, through an IV access device. This may be to correct dehydration or an electrolyte imbalance, to deliver medications, or for blood transfusion.

    IV fluids

    There are two types of fluids that are used for intravenous drips; crystalloids and colloids. Crystalloids are aqueous solutions of mineral salts or other water-soluble molecules. Colloids contain larger insoluble molecules, such as gelatin; blood itself is a colloid.
    The most commonly used crystalloid fluid is normal saline, a solution of sodium chloride at 0.9% concentration, which is close to the concentration in the blood (isotonic). Ringer's lactate or Ringer's acetate (ASERING, patented brandname of Otsuka Indonesia) is another isotonic solution often used for large-volume fluid replacement. A solution of 5% dextrose in water, sometimes called D5W, is often used instead if the patient is at risk for having low blood sugar or high sodium. The choice of fluids may also depend on the chemical properties of the medications being given.
    Intravenous fluids must always be sterile.
    Composition of Common Crystalloid SolutionsSolutionOther Name[Na+][Cl-][Glucose]D5W5% Dextrose002522/3D & 1/3S3.3% Dextrose / 0.3% saline5151168Half-normal saline0.45% NaCl77770Normal saline0.9% NaCl1541540Ringer's lactateLactated Ringer1301090
    Ringer's lactate also has 28 mmol/L lactate, 4 mmol/L K+ and 3 mmol/L Ca2+. Ringer's acetate (ASERING) also has 28 mmol/L acetate, 4 mmol/L K+ and 3 mmol/L Ca2+.
    Effect of Adding One LitreSolutionChange in ECFChange in ICFD5W333 mL667 mL2/3D & 1/3S556 mL444 mLHalf-normal saline667 mL333 mLNormal saline1000 mL0 mLRinger's lactate900 mL100 mL

    Infusion equipment

    A standard IV infusion set consists of a pre-filled, sterile container (glass bottle, plastic bottle or plastic bag) of fluids with an attached drip chamber which allows the fluid to flow one drop at a time, making it easy to see the flow rate (and also reducing air bubbles); a long sterile tube with a clamp to regulate or stop the flow; a connector to attach to the access device; and connectors to allow "piggybacking" of another infusion set onto the same line, e.g., adding a dose of antibiotics to a continuous fluid drip.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 10, 2010
  4. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use

    Risks of intravenous therapy
    Intravenous therapy has many risks and should therefore only be performed by trained personnel under medical supervision, using proper equipment.

    Infection

    Any break in the skin carries a risk of infection. Although IV insertion is a sterile procedure, skin-dwelling organisms such as Coagulase-negative Staphylococcus or Candida albicans may enter through the insertion site around the catheter, or bacteria may be accidentally introduced inside the catheter from contaminated equipment. Moisture introduced to unprotected IV sites through washing or bathing substantially increases the infection risks.
    Infection of IV sites is usually local, causing easily visible swelling, redness, and fever. If bacteria do not remain in one area but spread through the bloodstream, the infection is called septicemia and can be rapid and life-threatening. An infected central IV poses a higher risk of septicemia, as it can deliver bacteria directly into the central circulation.

    Phlebitis

    Phlebitis is irritation of a vein that is not caused by infection, but from the mere presence of a foreign body (the IV catheter) or the fluids or medication being given. Symptoms are swelling, pain, and redness around the vein. It does not necessarily mean the IV device must be removed; warmth, elevation of the affected limb, or a change in the rate of flow may resolve the symptoms.
    Due to frequent injections and recurring phlebitis, the peripheral veins of intravenous drug addicts, and of cancer patients undergoing chemotherapy, become hardened and difficult to access over time.

    Infiltration

    This occurs when the tip of the IV catheter withdraws from the vein or pokes through the vein into surrounding tissue, or when the vein's wall becomes permeable and leaks fluid (in this instance it is said that the cannula has 'tissued'). It occurs frequently with peripheral IVs, and requires replacement of the IV at a different location. The symptoms of pain and swelling are temporary and not dangerous, unless giving a highly irritating medication, such intravenous contrast or amiodarone. Additionally it can become dangerous if the person monitoring the IV site fails to recognize that an infiltration has occurred and fluid continues to drip in the tissue under the skin. It can cause a compression injury. This known as an infiltration injury.

    Fluid overload

    This occurs when fluids are given at a higher rate or in a larger volume than the system can absorb or excrete. Possible consequences include hypertension, heart failure, and pulmonary edema.

    Electrolyte imbalance

    Administering a too-dilute or too-concentrated solution can disrupt the patient's balance of sodium, potassium, magnesium, and other electrolytes. Hospital patients usually receive blood tests to monitor these levels.

    Embolism

    A blood clot or other solid mass, or an air bubble, can be delivered into the circulation through an IV and end up blocking a vessel; this is called embolism. Peripheral IVs have a low risk of embolism, since large solid masses cannot travel through a narrow catheter, and it is nearly impossible to inject air through a peripheral IV at a dangerous rate. The risk is greater with a central IV.
    Air bubbles of less than 30 milliliters generally dissolve into the circulation harmlessly. A larger amount of air, if delivered all at once, can cause life-threatening damage to pulmonary circulation, or, if extremely large (3-8 milliliters per kilogram of body weight), can stop the heart.
    One reason veins are preferred over arteries for intravascular administration is because the flow will pass through the lungs before passing through the body. Air bubbles can leave the blood through the lungs. A patient with a heart defect causing a right-to-left shunt is vulnerable to embolism from smaller amounts of air.
    Fatality by air embolism is vanishingly rare, in part because it is also difficult to diagnose.

    Extravasation

    Extravasation is the accidental administration of intravenously (IV) infused medicinal drugs into the surrounding tissue, either by leakage (e.g. because of brittle veins in very elderly patients), or directly (e.g. because the venflon has punctured the vein and the infusion goes directly into the arm tissue).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 10, 2010
  5. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use

    And here is what happens to people who say ' fuck it' all for a measy 20-30 MG (which would take like 3-5 ccs of liquid to dissolve: See electrolyte imbalance) if 20mg of hydro or oxy gets you high, you shouldnt IV anyways.

    http://www.iv-therapy.net/image/tid/2





    http://www.iv-therapy.net/node/31

    Check out them lungs. Looks healthy huh
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 11, 2007
  6. Hlucn8

    Hlucn8 Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    645
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2006
    Messages:
    152
    Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use

    “Jacking Pills”
    Wow! This is truly a complex issue; A high stakes game where the ante is swiyour life and the final hand is for keeps.
    Let swim begin by saying that this post is for harm reduction purposes only, and his true desire is not to entice anybody who would otherwise not consider such a serious game. If swiyou are determined to pursue this rout of administration, use what swim has to say along with extreme caution and serious foresight as a guide. This is based allot on swims experience, not definitive truth backed by a hundred years of sound medical research. If swiyou are on the fence and not sure if this is something swiyou wish to do, let me urge swiyou now to think better of it. SWIY could always try insufflation and rectal admin, right? Go on, do that… Good boy.
    Now, for the rest of swi-us.
    Swim has been prepping and injecting oral opiates since the summer of 1999. He has had many mishaps and some serious close calls. He will attempt to distill his years of trial and error here and outline the dangers involved with this rout of administration and some techniques to reduce the risks and avoid some mistakes.
    Lets begin by taking a close look at the composition of solid oral medications.

    Active Ingredients- Pay dirt! This is what were after. Lets look at the name of the chemicals in question. The first word in the drug is the generic name, which is based loosely on the way the molecule looks and functions in relation to the human organism. The second word in the name is the ester, salt, amine…etc, which denotes how it is going to function in relation to other chemicals it comes into contact with, (i.e.… ph, solubility, reactivity, and so forth).

    Opiates-In the case of opioid drugs we generally find the chemical in question in the form of a water soluble salt, which is very convenient for someone wishing to bypass the digestive tract and get it into his bloodstream quickly. The two most commonly prescribed orally active pain medications are Oxycodone Hydrochloride and Hydrocodone Bitartrate, (percocet and vicodan, respectively). Both are water soluble and can be injected directly into the bloodstream. (Important Note: Codeine should NOT be used I.V.! Very bad for the lungs and heart. It is safe to use codeine I.M and Sub.Q)

    APAP-Another common active ingredient in oral pain med is acetaminophen. Its important to note right off that it is not very soluble in H2O. Sooo, if one were to just “shake and bake” a pain med containing APAP, one would be injecting solid acetaminophen crystals into his cardiovascular system. Please Don’t do this. Any solids injected into the circulatory system will wreck havoc with your body, especially your lungs. There are I.V. preparations of acetaminophen, (not yet marketed in the U.S., but its on the way) and it appears to be safe for I.V. use. In high doses it becomes increasingly hepatotoxic, (toxic to the liver), and the effects are cumulative. The normal adult dose for I.V. APAP is 1 gram over a time, with a limit of 4 grams in a 24 hour period. It is metabolized by the liver, and hepatotoxicity is very dose dependant, interacting with other substances in the circulatory system which are metabolized by the liver. So, if swiyou have alcohol in swiyour system, and swiyou introduce APAP as well, you are setting up a concoction of chemicals in swiyour blood that will become increasingly dangerous for swiyour liver to have to process.
    Find an effective extraction tech. What little does go into solution in an I.V. prep is probably going to have the same effect as a proper I.V. preparation of APAP. This, however, is swims BIG ASSUMPTION. He tells me, in the years he has been doing his, that he is always very careful in his filtering out of unresolved solids, which would include APAP. He also has his liver function tested at least annually, and they have never come back abnormal, so it is probably a fair assumption.

    Others- There are a myriad of oral narcotics, with a wide range of active ingredients. It is imperative that anybody wishing to shoot something that was intended by the manufacturer to be orally ingested thoroughly familiarize himself with every active ingredient and how it affects his body. If there are lingering questions about an active ingredient, don’t freakin risk it! A PDR comes in very handy in this.

    Inactive Ingredients- The usual preparation of both Oxycodone and Hydrocodone is generally 5mg, with an FDA mandated limit of 15mg per tablet. 5mg of powder is not very big. So, to give the pill some mass, to keep it in its pill shape, and whatever else motivates the manufacturer to add substance x in with the drug, we find a whole slew of other ingredients mixed in. Talc, microcrystalline cellulose, different kinds of salt, sugars, and so on make the list. Most of them, if one were to introduce them into ones circulatory system, would begin to seriously screw up the human body. They would rapidly form granulomas throughout all the major organs, showing up in the lungs, the pancreas, liver, kidneys, …etc, seriously compromising their function. Thankfully, a lot of them are not water soluble and are easily filtered off. The ones that are generally are pretty benign. Its important to know, however. Take a close look at the list, which can be found in the description of the drug on the package insert. This handy dandy insert comes with every bottle of drug that a pharmacy receives, and a pharmacist I have found is usually very happy to give them to anybody upon request.
    swiyou have to be careful. Sometimes a drug company will put a substance into a pill preparation to make it either difficult, painful, or downright dangerous to I.V. them. This is becoming more and more the norm with the bigger dosed, sustained release tablets rather than the smaller immediate release stuff. Some of the ones being seen right now is; capsasin, the chemical responsible for giving peppers their “heat”. Naltrexone, which if crushed renders opiates inactive. Some crap swim cant spell that, when the pill is crushed and mixed with water becomes the consistency of warm snot-coated buggers. One substance swim came across, (don’t know what it was), went into solution and made it past the filtration process, but then precipitated out, causing a nasty thrombosis. With a little ingenuity and a basic knowledge of chemistry, they can be gotten around most of the time. The name of the game is to familiarize oneself with what it is that makes up the composition of the tablet and the physical properties of said substance. In this game, what you don’t know can kill you

    [FONT=Times New Roman][B]Other Dangers-[/B] Okay, swiy have prepped and filtered the crap out that poor 5 mg lortab until the adulterants are at a negligible level. Good to go, right? Nope! Sucker! Everything that stuff has come into contact with has introduced bacteria into the matrix. Usually you can be clean enough, boiling glass containers in the microwave, using distilled water,… etc, to minimize the risk to avoid any serious infections. Unless swiyou have a lab and are skilled in sterile technique, however, its tough to get a truly clean product. Is it a risk your willing to take? Swim has only suffered one major abscess in 7 years. That is probably a combination of a good immune system, good technique, and dumb luck. There is one method that will get you an almost sterile solution, and can be had for about ten bucks a pop. Syringe filters. It’s a little device that locks on to the end of a syringe, then the solution is forced through a micro filtration membrane. They have all size filtering options, from just solids suspended in the liquid down to one filtering out most bacteria. It’s a good idea to utilize one of these.[/FONT]
    [FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
    [FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]There are other things to consider which should be obvious, (addiction, O.D., stupidly high tolerance,… etc). Listen kids, don’t make these decisions lightly, mmmkay. Count the cost, consider your future, consider those that love you and how they would be effected if you ran into serious trouble jacking a stupid pill. People are going to do what there going to do. Swim sure did. Just be aware of yourself. If swiy know that you have a low I.Q., or are too lazy to go the extra mile to protect swiyourself, why not stick to booffing and snorting, huh?[/SIZE][/FONT][/FONT]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2017
  7. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use



    IV hydrocodone has the same risks of codeine as far as histimine reactions. You had better include that in there too. Codeine vials do exist, just like hydrocodone CAN be injected, but it should only be done in a hospital setting. And hydro/codiene isnt much of a rush anyway and you risk filling your lungs up with fluid and drowning yourself. So, by the same token, NEVER IV HYDROCODONE.


    Also, you seem to assume the risk of IVing APAP. Let it be known that this is a HUGE risk and never worth it. Im not angel and have done my share of nasty and unsafe stuff, but I do not condone the IV use of APAP preperations.

    Also, i think boiling a solution in the microwave to 'sterilize' it is so fucking wrong and out there, we should never talk about ti like it is 'okay'. Heat does breakdown opiates, and a microwave is producing WELL over 300 F
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2017
  8. Hlucn8

    Hlucn8 Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    645
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2006
    Messages:
    152
    Male
    Re: Info request for the dangers of injecting acetaminophen and IV pill use



    Okay, lets take a look at this statement. Before swim wrote this post he, like swiForTheSevenLakes, believed that I.V. APAP was a big "NONO". Turns out we were proved wrong. Undissolved APAP can be deadly, however, and swim said so in the body of the text. You're taking swim out of context, here.

    Let swim be redundant. swiMy original intention, (One of, anyway), was to find the medical literature to support the belief that an APAP injection would be a catastrophic insult to the liver and include it here. The truth, however, was quite the contrary; what swIm found was that I.V. APAP is very viable, being used more and more extensively, and actually better tolerated than oral APAP by the because of first pass metabolism. The published preliminary clinical trials are the supporting documents swim used to write this short, (swiI suppose swiI could begin inserting a bibliography into swims posts).

    Swim is not trying to pick a fight and wishes to extend the up most respect and courtesy to swiDr; but before you go trying to refute swimy statements, look at the literature and swims post again for yourself and you will see that swIm made no assumptions about I.V. APAP, (wherein it was dissolved in BA and BB).
    The assumption swIm Did assert was that what little APAP goes into an aqueous solution would be handled in the human organism exactly, (or at least much), the same way that APAP solved in BA and BB. So, please, read up on the most recent medical info, and avoid confusing what swIm said in your replies.




    Oh really? Granted, An autoclave or pressure cooker would be better for sterilizing a drug dilutant, (water). I am addressing, however, young stoner's whose buddy just showed him how to draw 10cc of tap water into the barrel of a syringe with a couple of Dilaudid in the barrel and "stat shaking".

    Well... This IS exactly what they are doing, swiDr.Jones, and will continue to do, unless somebody says to them,"Hey! Why not boil the water in a cup in the microwave first? It'll only take a few minuets longer!". "Oh, While your at it, you can throw your filter in for good measure."

    If you'll notice, in swims original post, he did not provide a step-by-step guide. I don't want anyone to do this, and don't really want to inform anybody on how. This was a post in the interest of "Harm Reduction", Not, "Hey Joey! This is something cool, yo! You should give it a "Shot"!
    SwIm just told our budding young junkie, who was on his way to the bathroom to do it anyway, there may be a safer-cleaner way that would not have occurred to him, keep him safer, and not take that much more time. No 14 year old stoner is going to spend 45 minutes at his grandmothers pressure cooker to sterilize his I.V. dilutant, but he just might toss that bacteria ridden 10cc of water in a tumbler glass along with a couple of filters, and greatly reduce his risk of acquiring a nasty staff infection. Again, I'm not condoning any of this, swI'm providing the best possible method to practice an unsafe act. I'm against pre-marital sex and will always counsel young people to wait, but once they've made the decision, the best I can do is tell them the "new way to play with their rubber ducky", see where I'm going with this, swiDr.Jones?
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...3&in_page_id=1770&in_page_id=1770&expand=true
    Goggle that and get back to swim.



    swIm never recommended using the wave to sterilize opiate chemicals. You need to go back and re-read my post, mate. swiI recommended using a sub-micron syringe filter.

    swiI appreciate you taking the time to read swims post and for adding to the discussion. I'm not trying to flame anybody here, swiI just take issue with some of what you have written.

    Swim enjoys writing about and sharing his research and personal experiences. That, along with harm reduction, is the whole point of these forums, right?

    He does not condone any destructive behaviors or try to pursued anyone that these actions are morally correct, (that is the job of a defendant, and they don't pay swim well enough for that). I think he made that clear in his post.

    By the same token, he does not condemn anybody for their choices, (That is a judges job, and he certainly doesn't get paid well enough for that!). I think he made that point clear as well.

    No, In this post swim merely gives testimony to what he has seen, heard, and extrapolated from his research along with personal experiences. Sharing personal theories that one believes to be fact, when supported by the empirical data garnered from the most recent clinical research on the subject, is by no means irresponsible IF the writer makes it clear to the reader the nature of that assumption, and provides the argumentation; The biggest obligation to the writer in such circumstances is for him to make aware to the reader those instances instead of trying to play it off as being fact included in the body of the original research texts he used to form his hypothesis, (or "BIG ASSUMPTION"s).
    So ,please, don't cuss at swim when swiy is responding to something he says. Its very poor form.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2017
  9. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    Hydrocodone should never be injected, for the same reason codeine should never be injected. PERIOD.

    Percocet would be hard to fit in a 3ml in concetrations higher than 30mg per 3ml. If that gets you high, just take it orally. It has an oral bioavability of ~70%. If 30mg of percocet gets you high, you don't need to be IVing.


    You have made the decisiion to go ahead and shoot pills with APAP. Its not a good idea for anyone, and don't come in here and try to argue how safe it is. Because it isn't. Someone without your long reaching knowledge would be less safe than you.
     
  10. Hlucn8

    Hlucn8 Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    645
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2006
    Messages:
    152
    Male
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    Oh Wow, Mannn. Again your missing swim's point, swiJones.
    Please, Somebody else out there, please tell swim you understood what he was trying to do here.. Please tell tell him did not waste another entire evening of writing!?!
     
  11. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    Well, if you are not discussing the dangers of IV APAP pills, why not make your own thread where we can discuss whatever you want. This thread is for newbies who come onthe forum and make a 'can I IV Loricet' thread. We should try not to consfuse them with all this jibba jabba
     
  12. Jatelka

    Jatelka Psychedelic Shepherdess Platinum Member & Advisor

    Reputation Points:
    5,668
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2005
    Messages:
    5,479
    Female from U.K.
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    The point is, people WILL try to inject pills, whatever is said. However inadvisable it is, however many links to gangrenous limbs, abscesses, emboli lungs etc, people WILL want to do it and they WILL find a way to do it.

    In SWIJ's view, anything that contributes to harm reduction needs to be discussed. SWIY may not agree, but there are valid points expressed throughout this thread.

    (Disclaimer: SWIJ does NOT recommend shooting pills: SWIY could die)
     
  13. Dr.Jones

    Dr.Jones Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    65
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    59
    97 y/o Male
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    You can 'find a way' to iv percocet, the same way you can 'find a way' to IV Sand. You can put anything smaller than a marble in your body, I am just trying to tell you, there are habits you can maintain for maybe 5 years and habits that will kill you in 2 weeks.
     
  14. Motorhead

    Motorhead Platinum Member & Advisor

    Reputation Points:
    994
    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,251
    43 y/o Male from Canada
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!

    Here is a manual, Getting of Right, prepared by the harm reduction coalition on safe injection practices. It doesn't directly concern pills and APAP removal, but safe and healthy injection techniques should be followed by any IV drug user. It is very comprehensive with many illustrations, and is very easy to read. Here in the file-archive Opium, opiate & opiods .
     
  15. fnord

    fnord

    Reputation Points:
    2,475
    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2003
    Messages:
    4,434
    Male
  16. BakaBilly

    BakaBilly Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    39
    Joined:
    May 8, 2007
    Messages:
    73
    39 y/o Male
    Re: The risks and dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questions!


    SWIM sees SWIYour point and even though SWIM will never EVER inject a pill I think SWIYour post was highly informative.

    People will do what they want and just because a bunch of people came on here and wrote "dont do it" at least someone posted "well if you ARE going to do it, at least try and make it as safe as possible.".
     
  17. white stripes

    white stripes Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2007
    Messages:
    2
    Male
    Re: Injecting Basics, dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questi

    Has any one heard about injecting Fortwin 30mg tabs (Pentazocine Lactate).
    If you can, how should this be done.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2017
  18. Ethyl

    Ethyl

    Reputation Points:
    145
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2007
    Messages:
    263
    Male from portugal
    Re: Injecting Basics, dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questi

    Safe injection of pills by extracting the alkaloids only.

    As most of you know there is a type of extraction that works pretty well in terms of purity. The acid/base extraction is a way to extract alkaloids from other substances, leaving a product that can be 99,9% pure..

    If you inject pills do a acid/base extraction.
     
  19. Ellis D.

    Ellis D. Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    4
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2005
    Messages:
    185
    Male from U.S.A.
    Re: Injecting Basics, dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questi

    what if SWIM just sucked the water/pill mixture through a cig filter and cotton on top of the cig filter. seems like you might pick up some of those sugars or other filler sh!t, maybe, but I doubt any serious damage would be done if SWIus shot that up?

    Swim has a lab rat withdrawing like a mofo right now and the rat has 10mg of hydrocodone(hahahahhahahahahha), 65mg of oxy, and 3 1/2 methadose 40mg wafers. Rat has been shooting 100 - 200mg of heroin a day for the past 3 months and has been on H for almost a year. It's been three days and the poor litle guy is shivering and aching like a like a crack whore god he says it's terrible. So obviously this rat is going to do SOMETHING. And it's most likely gonna be IV, so what do you guys think would hav the most effect after 2 1/2 days of sobriety and pain for little lab ratty; 65mg oxycodone (3250mg APAP I believe) or do up some methadone; which ever sucked through a cig filter and cotton......?
     
  20. supe

    supe Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    -5
    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    31
    Male from U.S.A.
    Re: Injecting Basics, dangers of IVing pills. READ THIS before posting IV pill questi

    listen to ethyl. do an acid/base extraction. if you do the cig filter and cotton you are still leaving around 40-30% of the no-no stuff in there which is bad. SWIM has been doing research on this and it seems that even wheel filters are not adequate. They can filter out viruses but when it comes to molecules such as certain fillers and binders they just pass right through. Some are large enough to be caught but some aren't like calcium carbonate we are talking in the lower, double digit nanometer range for size. You might seem ok if you do it once or twice maybe 500 times, but you will be causing damage to your body. You will eventually end up with blockages and have a stroke, MI, or lose a limb. Be safe out there