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Phenibut - High doses, full on addiction, and some facts worth noting.

Discussion in 'Other drug addiction' started by PsychoActivist, Jan 24, 2011.

  1. PsychoActivist

    PsychoActivist Palladium Member

    Reputation Points:
    Oct 28, 2008
    36 y/o from U.S.A.
    So today I was cleaning my room and I found a notebook someone had written in.. The section that stuck out to me was headed "My Phenibut experience", which read:

    There is more in this notebook but this is all I had time to type up. I hope whoever wrote this is doing better now. Somehow I doubt it

  2. cheshirez

    cheshirez Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    Feb 3, 2011
    30 y/o from U.S.A.
    It sounds like whoever wrote that knows they need to calm down and quit. He seems to have the rationale to understand what he needs to do and even the physical ability to do it but he needs to create motivation to.
  3. zapatista

    zapatista Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    Mar 29, 2005
    from U.S.A.
    AFOAF was full blown addicted to phenibut in conjunction with alcohol and GBL. Of all three, phenibut was the hardest to quit and had the worst withdrawal symptoms.
  4. Jatelka

    Jatelka Psychedelic Shepherdess Platinum Member & Advisor

    Reputation Points:
    Oct 16, 2005
    from U.K.
    ^^^ Could you elaborate a little, zapatista?

    What made the Phenibut withdrawal different? How did your Monkey get through it?
  5. KTMAdv

    KTMAdv Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    Dec 10, 2008
    from U.S.A.
    That sounds pretty similar to SWIM's experience. It's funny how when tolerance develops in SWIM, it develops up to a certain level and then sort of "sustains" and by that SWIM means that the anxiolytic and motivational effects level off and remain as long as he keeps dosing. SWIM never got any sort of motivational effects to the degree that person discusses, although it they were pronounced at higher doses for SWIM(SWIM never broke 4-5G per day but said he was pretty sensitive to most any drug on account of genetics and low body weight). It's pretty fascinating stuff, really - and at the same time, sloppy and imprecise as any sort of drug goes. I've read starkly contrasting reports from all sorts of SWIM's that discussed radically different reactions and addiction states, and withdrawals - all within the same realm of effects but to wildly varying degrees and proportions.

    And yet, when I would try to taper, it would have to be very gradual and precise to sort of "ride the anxiety wave" in to the shore, so to speak, and feel it dissipate while also not letting it grind him down.

    SWIM also found that Lyrica(pregabalin) prevented the anxiety of withdrawals, while not preventing the dopamine rebound(super energy, almost too much to sit still) in addition to the GABA rebound(horrible, debilitating anxiety and terror at even simple fears) that so many people experieince with GHB and Phenibut withdrawals. As in, no anxiety but LOTS of energy and limited need for sleep. Strange that that sounds like the symptoms whoever wrote that letter was having at extremely high doses?

    Regarding the addiction potential - SWIM always though it had the strangest sort of "Why not?" feeling with regards to re-dosing, very different than narcotics or other drugs of addiction. This was true even when he had experienced withdrawals at least once before at extended duration, due to hasty use and forgetfullness with regard to reordering(nothing to do with Phenibut - a basic personality trait). It felt more like a food to SWIM than it ever did a drug, in this sense - "just eat more when you get hungry again". I said it never felt like a drug until he experienced his first taste of withdrawals. Does that make sense? I thought so.

    It's clearly more dopaminergic for whoever wrote that journal, given the hypermotivational element mentioned....
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2011
  6. Troppo

    Troppo Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    Feb 17, 2010
    from Australia
    I realise this thread is somewhat old but I just wanted to mention that quite a few people who take huge daily doses of the GABA(B) agonist baclofen as an alcoholism treatment also report the same lack of sleep, and also waking up refreshed after little sleep. Obviously an unusual effect of GABA-B agonists, at least in high doses.
  7. MusiciansMallet

    MusiciansMallet Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    Oct 23, 2007
    from U.S.A.
    Baclofen is a GABA-b agonist; its been shown to help w/ withdrawal from GABA-a positive allosteric modulators (PAM for short) that bind to the BP (benzodiazepine) receptor on GABA-a subunits; usually on alpha1-4 & 6; & y1-5.. ethanol is known to bind here as well. And at that, w/ Baclofen w/d seems to be nonexistent if weaned properly (easier, than say, benzodiazepines), at least IME.

    But baclofen has an unknown psychopharmacological property that may or may not be related to its GABA-b agonism; its been shown to reduce cravings in opiate addicts (i know w/o even thinking or wanting to do it, it reduced my buprenorphine MT dose from 4mg to 2mg in a week--otherwise unheard of). It's being investigated on cocaine users w/ much success, too.
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2014
  8. Subvert

    Subvert Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    May 5, 2009
    from scotland
    Thank you for sharing!

    I'd like to say to those who are dabbling with this substance,
    Even short periods of use can produce a sort of hangover / rebound anxiety -
    It's unpleasant but better to go through this than continue using Phenibut,
    While you still can come out the other side without requiring GABAminergics (Baclofen, Pregabalin, etc).