1. Dear Drugs-Forum readers: We are a small non-profit that runs one of the most read drug information & addiction help websites in the world. We serve over 4 million readers per month, and have costs like all popular websites: servers, hosting, licenses and software. To protect our independence we do not run ads. We take no government funds. We run on donations which average $25. If everyone reading this would donate $5 then this fund raiser would be done in an hour. If Drugs-Forum is useful to you, take one minute to keep it online another year by donating whatever you can today. Donations are currently not sufficient to pay our bills and keep the site up. Your help is most welcome. Thank you.
    PLEASE HELP
    Dismiss Notice

Drug info - Pregabalin (Lyrica): Information and (hopefully) Experiences

Discussion in 'Downers and sleeping pills' started by thatsall, Jan 6, 2006.

  1. thatsall

    thatsall Silver Member

    Age:
    32
    Reputation Points:
    21
    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Messages:
    143
    Has anyone ever heard of LYRYCA(PREGABALIN). I was perscribed it today by my doc for anxiety. I did a google search and read that:

    "Pregabalin has a novel mechanism of action for a potential treatment for anxiety disorders, although it is not completely understood. Chemically, pregabalin is a gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) analogue with antiepileptic, analgesic, and anxiolytic activity (similar to gabapentin (Neurontin)).
    Data from short-term studies demonstrates that pregabalin was more effective than placebo and as effective as the benzodiazepine Xanax (alprazolam) and the antidepressant Effexor (venlafaxine) at reducing the symptoms of anxiety. Pregabalin achieved significantly faster onset of sustained clinical improvement within the first week of treatment than placebo. Similar significant and sustained improvement within the first week was not achieved by either Xanax or Effexor.
    Also, according to clinical trial findings, pregabalin relieves pain and fatigue symptoms in patients with fibromyalgia"

    I was wondering if anyone has expiereinced this new drug for pain or anxiety. Any info woul be wonderful since so little is known about it. I also read that it lowers your fertility rate, this was shown on animals and alot of animals that did have babies, had babies with defects. Kinda scary.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2010
  2. thatsall

    thatsall Silver Member

    Age:
    32
    Reputation Points:
    21
    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Messages:
    143
    Lyrica(pregabalin) Strong Stuff!

    I was recently perscribed lyrica (pregabalin) it the new super Neurotonin. Fairly new to the market It is the same thing but works better because of the new delievery system. It is perscribed for pain relief of nerve pain. Off label it can be perscribed for anxiety and depression. I suffer from both, i think they kinda go hand in hand anyway, but at my regular dose of 100mg twice a day i was getting no relief. I did some research and read a few reports on recreational use, so i figure i got it and it aint helping i shouldnt let it go to waste. According to a few reports, people got a GHB/XTC high. This made me curious and to tell you the truth excited. The doses to recieve such a high was around 600mgs, which is safe, and for some the regular dose. So i decide to test it out:

    At about 7:30 wke up got ready for the day and took the 600mgs. About 15 minutes later i was driving and I notcied some intoxicated feelings. My driving was shit. If i would have gotten pulled over i would have failed the sobriety test. When. About 10 minutes later i reached my destination and got out of the car with some stumbling. I was very disoriented and my eyes felt lie a hundred pounds. I know without even seeing them their cashed. Now 8:30 and i'm waiting for my meeting. I have a nice body high and feel very druinkish. in the meeting my speech was somewhat slurred and broken. My words sounded crumbly, if that makes sense. My the lady i met was very gorgeuos and fun, i still had my evident anxirty but i think it might have been a little worse beause not only is my anxiety the same as normal but i'm wasted in the meeting so that makes me look bad, whatever, fugetaboutit.
    It is now 7:30 at night and I feel the power of Lyrica still. It is amzaing. Although i did not recieve any XTC like feelings besides maybe the body high, i was, am wasted. I cant beleive how strong and long lasting this stuff is. I think if i wasnt it this rut im in being depressed and having this anxity this could have been a way better high. Still nice though/ I do reccomend anyone who comes across it to give it a shot. It is scheduled at the lowest level, i believe Class V is where it stands. As for the GHB like effects i cannot say because i have never done it but very strong and disociating at 600mg for me.
     
  3. oggy

    oggy R.I.P.

    Age:
    34
    Reputation Points:
    419
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    532
    What is it like for pain? I need to change my meds to a non opiate pain reliever.
     
  4. thatsall

    thatsall Silver Member

    Age:
    32
    Reputation Points:
    21
    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Messages:
    143
    From what ive read its great for pain associated with diabetic peripheral neuropathy (DPN) and postherpetic neuralgia (PHN). I have neaither of these to my knowledge so i wouldnt know. I would say by the body high that it has some signicant potential. It did relieve some light joint pain that I suffer from. Its worth a shot if you have eithewr or the above disorders. Ask your doctor and see what he says.
     
  5. oggy

    oggy R.I.P.

    Age:
    34
    Reputation Points:
    419
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    532
    Cheers I will. It not as easy to get a script in the UK for what you want. They'll probably just try to give me some sort of anti inflammatory drug witch is no good for me as they have lots of side effects and stop protien syntesis. I work out and I've heard of people losing muscle while training so thats a big no no for me.

    So why did they prescribe lyrica to you? What kind of nerve pain do you have?
     
  6. Gahaba22

    Gahaba22 Gold Member

    Reputation Points:
    137
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2004
    Messages:
    139
    Anti-imflammatory meds like Ibuprofen or aspirin do not inhibit protein synthesis. They inhibit prostaglandin synthesis as well as thrombaxanes

    Lyrica is only for pain caused by neuropathy. Although is has the word pregabalin as a generic name, it is not related to gaba or gabapentin (neurontin). It is a totally different chemical
     
  7. thatsall

    thatsall Silver Member

    Age:
    32
    Reputation Points:
    21
    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Messages:
    143
    Well i just meant it is used for the same things and does the same thing in users, but it just works more, more of the time. I wasn't speaking chemically or anything. I shoudl have been more clear for theose who misinterpretted.
     
  8. Jatelka

    Jatelka Psychedelic Shepherdess

    Reputation Points:
    5,668
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2005
    Messages:
    5,479
    A friend of SWIJ's recently got prescribed this for anxiety (hence here in "Downers" rather than in "Various").

    Although obviously an accepted treatment, see here...

    http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&id=1103&catid=27

    SWIJ realised she knew nothing about it. UTFSE yielded little. So she hopes this helps:

    Pregabalin is described chemically as (S)-3-(aminomethyl)-5-methylhexanoic acid. The molecular formula is C8H17NO2.

    It is a white to off-white, crystalline solid. It is freely soluble in water and both basic and acidic aqueous solutions.

    It binds with high affinity o the alpha2-delta site (an auxiliary subunit of voltage-gated calcium channels) in central nervous system tissues. Although the mechanism of action of pregabalin is unknown, results with genetically modified mice and with compounds structurally related to pregabalin (such as gabapentin) suggest that binding to the alpha2-delta subunit may be involved in pregabalin’s anti-nociceptive and anti-seizure effects in animal models. In vitro, pregabalin reduces the calcium-dependent release of several neurotransmitters, possibly by modulation of calcium channel function.

    While pregabalin is a structural derivative of the inhibitory neurotransmitter gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), it does not bind directly to GABAA, GABAB, or benzodiazepine receptors, does not augment GABAA responses in cultured neurons, does not alter GABA concentration in the rat brain or seem to have acute effects on GABA uptake or degradation. However, in cultured neurons prolonged application of pregabalin increases the density of GABA transporter protein and increases the rate of functional GABA transport. Pregabalin does not block sodium channels, is not active at opiate receptors, and is inactive at serotonin and dopamine receptors. Neither does it seem to inhibit dopamine, serotonin, or noradrenaline reuptake.

    Pregabalin is well absorbed after oral administration, is eliminated largely by renal excretion, and has a half-life of about 6 hours.

    Peak plasma concentrations occur within 1.5 hours. The oral bioavailability is ³ 90% and is independent of dose. Following repeated administration, steady state is achieved within 24 to 48 hours.

    Although there are no data in humans, pregabalin has been shown to cross the blood brain barrier in mice, rats, and monkeys. It also crosses the placenta and is found in the breast milk of rats.

    It undergoes negligible metabolism in humans. Approximately 90% of the administered dose is recovered unchanged in the urine in those with normal renal function.

    It does not seem to inhibit human CYP1A2, CYP2A6, CYP2C9, CYP2C19, CYP2D6, CYP2E1, and CYP3A4 enzyme systems. (The potential of pregabalin to induce these enzymes has not been studied in vitro)

    Lyrica is licensed (in the UK) for generalised anxiety disorder, as an adjunctive therapy in partial epilepsy and for the treatment of neuropathic pain. Looking at rxlist it seems that in the US the license is restricted to adjuncts in epilepsy and neuropathic pain secondary to diabetic neuropathy and also post-herpetic neuralgia.

    For epilepsy doses of 150mg-600mg/day are used (divided doses).

    In post-herpetic neuralgia the recommended dose is 150 to 300 mg/day (again, divided doses) although doses up to 600mg per day have been used.

    For neuropathic pain a dose of 300mg per day in divided doses is used.

    Side Effects:

    Abdominal pain, Allergic reaction, Fever, Abscess, Cellulitis, Chills, Malaise, Neck rigidity, Pelvic pain, Photosensitivity reaction, Suicidal ideation and intent, self harm, Heart failure, Hypotension, Postural hypotension, Retinal problems, Syncope, Anxiety, Depersonalization, Increased muscular tone, Altered sensation, Decreased Libido, Nightmares, Agitation, Itch, Conjunctivitis, Dry eyes, Loss of taste, Anorgasmia, Impotence, Urinary frequency, Urinary incontinence

    Rarely: Anaphylaxis, Ascites, Granuloma, Hangover effect, , Retroperitoneal Fibrosis, Shock, Suicide, ECG abnormalities, Ventricular Fibrillation, Gastroenteritis, Increased appetite, Easy bruising, Anaemia, Low white cell count (and subsequent increased risk of infection), Lymphadenopathy, Low platelet count, Joint and Muscle pain, Cramps, Ventricular Fibrillation, Cholecystitis, Cholelithiasis, Colitis, Dysphagia, Oesophagitis, Gastritis, Gastrointestinal haemorrhage and peptic ulceration, Pancreatitis, Bone Marrow Fibrosis, Abnormal clotting, Decreased glucose tolerance (leading to diabetes) Hallucinations, Addiction, Psychotic reations, Extra-Pyramidal Symptoms (E.g.: Parkinsonism), Lung fibrosis, Alopecia, Eczema: Abnormal ejaculation, Albuminuria, Amenorrhea, Dysmenorrhea, Dysuria, Hematuria, Kidney calculus, Leukorrhea, Menorrhagia, Metrorrhagia, Nephritis, Oliguria, Urinary retention, Rare: Acute kidney failure, Balanitis, Bladder Neoplasm, Cervicitis, Dyspareunia, Epididymitis, Female lactation, Glomerulonephritis

    It is a Schedule V controlled substance in the US

    In a study of recreational users (N=15) of sedative/hypnotic drugs, including alcohol, Lyrica (450 mg, single dose) received subjective ratings of "good drug effect," "high" and "liking" to a degree that was similar to diazepam (30 mg, single dose). In controlled clinical studies in over 5500 patients, 4% of Lyrica-treated patients and 1% of placebo-treated patients overall reported euphoria as an adverse event, though in some patient populations studied, this reporting rate was higher and ranged from 1 to 12%.

    In clinical studies, following abrupt or rapid discontinuation of pregabalin, some patients reported symptoms including insomnia, nausea, headache or diarrhoea, suggestive of physical dependence. Pregabalin should be tapered gradually over a minimum of 1 week rather than discontinued abruptly.

    Since pregabalin is predominantly excreted unchanged in humans, and does not bind to plasma proteins, its pharmacokinetics are unlikely to be affected by other agents through metabolic interactions or protein binding displacement.

    In vitro and in vivo studies showed that LYRICA is unlikely to be involved in significant pharmacokinetic drug interactions.

    In standard preclinical in vivo lifetime carcinogenicity studies of pregabalin, an unexpectedly high incidence of hemangiosarcoma was identified in two different strains of mice.The clinical significance of this finding is unknown.

    Clinical experience during pregabalin’s premarketing development provides no direct means to assess its potential for inducing tumours in humans.

    In clinical studies across various patient populations, comprising 6396 patient-years of exposure in patients >12 years of age, new or worsening pre-existing tumours were reported in 57 patients. Without knowledge of the background incidence and recurrence in similar populations not treated with LYRICA, it is impossible to know whether the incidence seen in these cohorts is or is not affected by treatment

    In fertility studies in male rats, a number of adverse effects were observed. These included decreased sperm counts and sperm motility, increased sperm abnormalities, reduced fertility, increased preimplantation embryo loss, decreased litter size, and an increased incidence of foetal abnormalities.

    There is limited experience with overdose of pregabalin. The highest reported accidental overdose was 8000 mg, and there were no notable clinical consequences.

    Any thoughts/comments?

    SWIJ wonders why Extra-Pyramidal effects are listed as an AE when pregabalin "apparently" does not have effects at dopamine receptors.

    The glossing over of the apparent carcinogenicity with a bland comment about "We don't know whether this has an effect in humans" also seems worrying.

    Finally: Does any SWIY/flamingo/monkey/rat/other mammalian lifeform have any Lyrica experinces (either therapeutically or recreationally)?

    EDIT: Sources rxlist, bnf.org
     
  9. Nicaine

    Nicaine Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    869
    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,362
    Update on Pregabalin -- can anyone confirm?

    I'd like to post an update on pregabalin (Lyrica). In the past SWIM has experienced nothing but nasty side effects (or nothing at all), but he believes to have found a use for it that may in fact be of tremendous interest to at least some of the recreational-drugs community.

    Recently SWIM was high on stimulants and looking for something to relax a bit (what else is new with stimulant users, usually it's benzos or sedative-hypnotics though... except he ran out of Lunesta). So SWIM dissolved 50mg of Lyrica in 10mL hot water, and plugged just FOUR ml of the solution (20mg Lyrica) up his rear end.

    The effect was remarkable. In five to ten minutes, SWIM felt exactly like he did prior to beginning stimulant use. In other words, this small dose brought him all the way back down to baseline (aside from a continued rapid heart rate) with no "comedown" effect at all. He found this so interesting that he plugged another 4ml of the solution soon after that. This brought on a state of fuzzy-headedness, fatigue, slight clumsiness and a feeling like wanting to go to bed. He was at this point significantly below baseline normal, despite still having a goodly dose of stimulants in his bloodstream.

    I hope people can see the implications here -- apparently this stuff is capable of completely bringing a person down off a stimulant high, skipping all the usual unpleasantness in between. Not sure how well it would work with the REALLY powerful stims (e.g. methamphetamine) but it may be worth a try. A huge point in its favor is that it is hardly metabolized at all (excreted as unchanged drug) and so it tends not to interact with other substances. Also (as SWIM found out) it's freely water soluble and thus "pluggable," if that's SWIY's cup of tea.

    Now, just a few hints from the online medical literature as to why this may have happened. I can't post links to all of these, as the presence of ads may break forum rules.
    Corroboration welcome, or any other feedback for that matter.

    P.S. final note -- apparently pregabalin does interact with a few drugs (oxycodone and a couple others) so SWIY should definitely consult their doctor and/or do the proper research.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2007
  10. DrMuffy

    DrMuffy

    Reputation Points:
    510
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2006
    Messages:
    467
    SWIdr has tried Pregabalin a couple times, and the experiences were simalar to his gabapentin (very simalar drug). He seemed very relaxed (anxiety free), not too too much euphoria but some, DXM dissociative-like effects, somewhat of a painkilling effect, and mild sleepiness.

    NOTE: These drug trials were tried with (considered) higher doses of the selected medications.
     
  11. Broshious

    Broshious Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    287
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    388
    SWIM has experience with both Lyrica and Gabapentin. SWIM first got into Gabapentin after reading about it being useful recreationally on the web. SWIM ordered some online and took 600mg, 1200mg, and then bam 1800mg and SWIM was in heaven. This was SWIM first real drug experience so while it seemed great then it certainly pales in comparison to say (Methylone), but at the time the euphoria was great. SWIM suffers from a fair amount of social anxiety, but when SWIM took Gabapentin(tolerance occurs very quickly with daily usage so ever increasing amounts are needed) there was no anxiety whatsoever along with a very relaxed euphoria. SWIM found himself singing along(out in the open where people could possibly hear him which would normally be a terrifying thing) to the music of his MP3 player. An added bonus is the effects would tend to last just about all day. Occassionally SWIM would get very tired from taking it but that seemed to be a fairly random occurrence. In fact one night SWIM took a good-sized dose and then felt so sleepy he passed out before it had even started to work. He woke up the next day and he was still high for the next couple hours.

    Now, SWIM knows the question was about Lyrica but in SWIMs experience Lyrica behaves almost exactly like Gabapentin(albeit at a lower dose and since SWIM had developed a pretty high tolerance for Gabapentin, 10g doses to get high where he had started at 1.8g it wasn't as euphoric as his first experiences). SWIM has to agree with Nicaine that Lyrica helps a lot with relaxing after/during stimulants. SWIM took 30mg Adderall after taking 1.5g Lyrica and he remained energized while not getting anxious as higher dose stimulants tend to do to him. Also, SWIM has taken 1.5g after taking Methylone because SWIM sometimes has anxious comedowns and this totally obliterated them. Note that SWIM tried timing the Lyrica to hit at the same time as the Methylone but noticed no synergy here.

    Hope this helps a bit.
     
  12. Nicaine

    Nicaine Titanium Member

    Reputation Points:
    869
    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,362
    SWIM has continued to plug pregabalin occasionally (he may be the world's first! ;) ) and definitely enjoys it... he feels it has some recreational potential used this way, at least as much as the average benzo. In doses less than 50mg, the stuff feels euphoric and relaxing (somewhat benzo-like, but probably even better) when dissolved in warm water and plugged. It's a very different buzz than when taken orally... SWIM guesses the increased bioavailability and speed of absorption really helps a lot in this case.
     
  13. valdez18

    valdez18

    Reputation Points:
    -6
    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2005
    Messages:
    11
    Well SWIM tried both Lyrica and Gabapentin exstensively, and they both kinda give the same effect, it's just that Lyrica (Pregabalin) seems stronger as far as dosage potency goes. To him it's kinda like comparing hydrocodone to oxycodone. SWIM has been taking lyrica lately but is going to switch back to gabapentin again, just because he likes the way it feels better, not to mention his insurance wont cover the pregabalin.


    But anyway SWIM has tried to dissolve the lyrica in hot water and the lyrica just starts puffing up, i think it could be from the lactose monohydrate that's in the lyrica pills. Also SWIM would like to IV the solution if it can be done, and is looking for experience from people who know if it can be done.
     
  14. Lehendakari

    Lehendakari Gold Member

    Reputation Points:
    610
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2006
    Messages:
    697
    SWIM dosed 2400 mg gabapentine on empty stomach. He waited quite a bit cause he read gabapentine has slow onset. 2 hours later he didn't quite feel anything. Nothing at all, not even the typical placebo effects.

    He started drinking heavily after that assuming gabapentine had no effects. 1 hour later he was drunk but didn't notice anything different, gabapentine neither increased nor decreased alcohol effects. He then took 40 mg methylphenidate orally and continued drinking. 1 hour later was feeling pretty euphoric and warm, very good mood and love, similar to XTC feeling. He was all the time kissing and hugging his friends. Normally when he takes rits and drinks, the alcohol buzz is killed by the rits, but this time was different, he was pissed and at the same time enregetic and euphoric. Jaw pressure was not relieved by gabapentin though.

    CONCLUSION: Gabapentine on its own is a waste of time, but it seems a good aid when stimulants are used.

    PD. Maybe the extra empathogenic and "love" feelings were due to gabapentine, but if this was the case gabapentine has an onset of +3 hours which seems unlikely
     
  15. Broshious

    Broshious Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    287
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    388
    Gabapentin onset for SWIM is usually around 2 hours. Taking it with food increases absorption(~15%) so SWIY might try that. 2400mg is a fair sized dose but SWIY may need a higher one.
     
  16. Lehendakari

    Lehendakari Gold Member

    Reputation Points:
    610
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2006
    Messages:
    697

    That's interesting, do you have a reference?, Also could you explain how SWIY feels the onset?
     
  17. Broshious

    Broshious Silver Member

    Reputation Points:
    287
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    388
    Food increases absorption by 14% (Wikipedia). SWIM also read on one website that Alleve increases absorption by 15%, but he can't verify it. The onset is fairly subtle sometimes and pretty obvious others. The easiest way for SWIM to tell is music sounds much better and he prefers it a good bit louder than usual. He also feels very relaxed and sometimes he feels a sort of pressure in his head(as when taking Methylone amoung other drugs).
     
  18. CamelFrisbee

    CamelFrisbee Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2
    SWIM has been taking Lyrica steadily for about a week recreationally. SWIM has reported varying levels of a hightened mental state concurrent with a feeling of both mental and physical euphoria. SWIM also stated that their motor functions were not in fact impared but at times even better than normal when engaged in activities that were familiar such as work, playing music, ect (things that require little planning or other mental faculties). SWIM did not disclose dosage amounts other than between 2 to 6 tablets. SWIM has compared their experiences with a diabetic who also takes Lyrica and Morphine (15mg) and found that Lyrica has a greater effect on them both.
    SWIM also stated there was little to no post euphoric depression, however SWIM is also taking an antidepressant (SSRI).

    I hope this account is usefull to someone.
     
  19. Fantasian

    Fantasian

    Age:
    29
    Reputation Points:
    1,057
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,158
    Is there any information on combining MDMA and Lyrica? SWIF would like to know if it works well towards the end of an MDMA experience.
     
  20. CamelFrisbee

    CamelFrisbee Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2
    Swim has been combining alcohol (this is a no no according to the don't do thats on the label) and thc in moderation and has found it to be a "comfortable mixture" as Swim put it. There is not a lot of info out there as to what kind of reactions will occur with recreational things as this Lyrica is fairly new. Swim says find a comfy chair and put on some tunes regardless.