Side effects - Quetiapine and Tardive Dyskinesia?

Discussion in 'Antipsychotics' started by BobTheGreat, Feb 8, 2007.

  1. BobTheGreat

    BobTheGreat Silver Member

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    I was prescribed 50mg of seroquel a night to help as a sleep aid and to help with anxiety about a week and a half ago by his psychiatrist. This afternoon I noticed his right hand started trembling when was typing on his keyboard. Swim's immediate thought was TD but kind of ignored it at first. As the afternoon went on, it progressively got worse so he tried to call his psych who was already out for the night so he left a message. I feel like he is up shit creek without a paddle. Is there anything he can do to help with the shaking? Will this most likely go away or is swim screwed for life? I am so frustrated right now he wants to break every bone in his psych's body for putting him on such a harsh drug without warning swim of the horrible side effects or even suggesting another possible treatment option.:mad::mad: Any help would be very greatly appreciated.
     
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  2. Nagognog2

    Nagognog2 Iridium Member

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    50 mg of seroquel is a rather low dose. I don't say how long he was taking this, but tardive dyskinesia isn't commonly associated with seroquel, though the jury is still out on what all side-effects can occur with this drug. But, unfortunately, doctors are being deluged with propaganda from drug companies and seroquel is being prescribed off-label for many things it wasn't designed for. I see it as the new prozac.

    I'd say it's unlikely I had TD. But should certainly be speaking with his physician.
     
  3. BobTheGreat

    BobTheGreat Silver Member

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    swim realizies that it is a low dose and has been taking it a short period of time but I am having muscle tremors. Mostly his hands are shaking like a Parkinson's patient. I take the 50 mg of seroquel and 10mg of lexapro daily. Today I had also taken .5 mg of xanax because he woke up having an anxiety attack a few hours before all this started. This is all that is in swim's system drug wise.

    Swim used a fair amout of crack in the months of Nov and Dec. My hands would always shake. He isnt quite sure but doesnt think they did this the first couple of time though. However, as time went on it did get worse. I have read that some people can gain sensitivity instead of tolerance with crack. I'm not exactly sure how seroquel works(and cant find anything but general stuff). I know it does affect the dopamine parts of the brain so could this be making him more sensative to seroquel?

    I am also finding his concentration sucks even more than usual and he is missing letters in simple words and has to type them into google to find the right spelling. Also the symptoms are much milder than earlier.
     
  4. bewilderment

    bewilderment Drug Geek Extraordinaire Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    I wouldn't worry too terribly much about permanent effects from seroquel simply because you took a low dosage for a short amount of time. It's probably not TD, and problems will most likely just go away (if they don't, then you could have a good case for a lawsuit). I think the best thing to do is simply stop the medication (if you haven't for some reason) and call the doc as soon as possible. In the meantime, here's what wikipedia says about TD treatment (but, it's probably just some other side effects manifesting):


    Also, seroquel can and has caused TD, but it is one of the antipsychotics with the least likelihood to cause it. Here is the full run-down of warnings concerning seroquel:

    MMedit: The above is from a site containing links to other forums & potential sources.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 8, 2007
  5. Jatelka

    Jatelka Psychedelic Shepherdess Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    "Tardive dyskinesia is characterized by repetitive, involuntary, purposeless movements. Features of the disorder may include grimacing, tongue protrusion, lip smacking, puckering and pursing of the lips, and rapid eye blinking. Rapid movements of the arms, legs, and trunk also occur"

    You should definitely speak to their physician, but tremor/trembling alone would be unlikely to be TD.
     
  6. Micklemouse

    Micklemouse Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    As stated above it is highly unlikely that SWiY have Tardive Dyskinesia, especially given the dose & short time SWiY have been taking it. And I certainly wouldn't worry about Neuroleptic Malignant Syndrome at this stage...

    What SWiY is experiencing is a mild form of what are known as Extra-Pyramidal Symptoms, which are related to, & often called Parkinsonian Symptoms, & include at the lighter end of the spectrum the tremor that SWiY describe. These are common in people taking antipsychotic drugs, even the newer atypical ones such as Seroquel especially early in treatment, & usually pass relatively quickly without the need for anticholinergens or other medication.

    A couple of questions:- firstly, is SWiY taking any other medication? Secondly, has SWiY had any uncharacteristic stiffness, especially in the jaw, shoulders & wrists, been feeling restless, or been salivating excessively? These symptoms are rare with Seroquel, especially at such a low dose, but can happen. They are treatable, but as I said earlier usually pass quickly. Definitely speak to SWiYour doc about this though. Although these potential unwnted effects should have been highlighted in the patient information leaflet that came with the meds, SWiY doc should really have told SWiY about them. That said, in future always take the initiative & ask about any potential unwanted effects SWiYourself too.

    For more info read dangers of anti psycotics ?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 8, 2007
  7. BobTheGreat

    BobTheGreat Silver Member

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    thanks for the replies. The shaking has pretty much subsided. GAD + wierd side effects= overreation.:eek:

    Mickle- I have been taking the seroquel(50mg), lexapro(10mg), and xanax(as needed for anxiety/panic attacks ~1mg per day)
    stiffness- yes
    restless- yes
    excess saliva- swim produces excess on his own but it seems to be a bit worse lately
     
  8. Micklemouse

    Micklemouse Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    The difficulty here is sussing out which med is causing the symptoms, as they are possible side effects of both. I'm guessing that SWiY hasn't been taking the escitalopram for long either then? Tremor, restlessness & increased salivation can be amongst the less common unwanted effects of SSRI's as well as antipsychotics - more common on withdrawal, or on high doses for lengthy periods, but have also been noted in people early in treatment. Again, it should pass, but should still be brought to SWiYour doctor's notice, & if it is unbearable the medication should be stopped. Keep an eye on it without looking for it(if that makes sense!) & keep in contact with SWiYour doc. Like I said, these symptoms are usually transient, & should pass as SWiYour body adjusts to the new chemicals it is being introduced to.

    Best of luck! (Great Avatar btw:))
     
  9. duncdunc68

    duncdunc68 Silver Member

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    Yeah QB, sounds more like he's got a bit of dystonia possibly exacerbated by withdrawal symptoms.
     
  10. Taj

    Taj Newbie

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    I am currently on seroquel at doses of 300-400 mg/night to treat a schizo-affective disorder (schizophrenia combined with chronic clinical depression and insomnia). I have not noticed any TD from these doses, however when I took Geodon he would notice TD every night approximately 21 hours after the previous dose. Sometimes it was so intense that I could not even hold a glass of water without spilling it everywhere. Geodon also proved to have many other negative side effects for SWIM but those will be discussed in the appropriate forum.
     
  11. dwilkes7

    dwilkes7 Silver Member

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    Re: Has Seroquel (Quetiapine) given Swim TD

    Bob, you mentioned You had a "panic attack" a while before the tremors began.

    Just an outside guess here, but during a panic attack, epinephrine is released into the system. It's very powerful and one of it's side effects is hand tremors.

    Just trying to cover all the bases.
     
  12. BobTheGreat

    BobTheGreat Silver Member

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    Re: Has Seroquel (Quetiapine) given Swim TD

    dwiks,
    I wasnt having any panic attacks when the trembling was going on so I doubt that was the cause.



    From what I has read seroquel can do some pretty nasty things to one's blood sugar. I has started to wonder if hypoglycemia caused the trembling. I also have a predispositon for type 2 diabetes so maybe it caused it to manifest as he has been showing a lot of signs lately... He has been thinking about taking a trip to the doctor when he get the extra money(not having insurance sucks). If he does have it, i'm sure there will be plenty of lawyers willing to assess his case.:D


    Oh yeah and one quick note: Swim came home drunk a few nights ago an accidentally dosed himself with 100mg of seroquel(the pill are the same size and shape as his sleeping pills:eek: ). It knocked him out pretty quick but he woke up about 2 hours later with the pain in his extremities and restlessness. Even though he was still pretty drunk he had to take a couple asprin to get back to bed. Needless to say they met his garbage diposal the next day.
     
  13. toe

    toe Gold Member

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    Quoted for emphasis. It's my understanding that "tardive" refers to chronic symptoms (similar to those of EPS) resulting from long-term chronic use of these meds. Hence the "tardive" part of the name. TD is chronic, while EPS is acute and can generally be shut down with a dose of benztropine.

    Factoring in the low dose and short period of therapy, TD is, well, almost impossible. But the extra-pyramidal symptoms are certainly something one should not have to deal with and the gremlin in my closet says you should demand a change in your med regime if you feel your symptoms fit the profile for EPS.

    Interestingly enough, AAPs have not been found to have a lower risk of EPS and TD than the Old School. The figures I remember offhand are 18% for haloperidol and 22% for olanzapine. I do not currently have access to the reference, but I did just come across a nice article dispelling the myth that a) adverse reactions to atypicals only occur at high doses, and b) only in the elderly (the primary demographic studied).
     
  14. OccularFantasm

    OccularFantasm Silver Member

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    Re: Has Seroquel (Quetiapine) given Swim TD

    This has nothing to do with TD. But, you had mentioned having panic attacks Bob. Swim thinks he can understand reasoning for these. Obviously there are factors I am not aware of, as I has never actually met bob. Swimwoudl have to guess however that one possible cause wouldbe fromt he antipsychotics in and of themselves. These drugs act by repressing the dopamine receptors. As many of you know, dopamine is needed for pleasure. This explains the euphoria meth addicts gets as well as other various drugs. This covers the uncomfertable 'anti-euphoric', if you will, effects. The next part is commonly avoded or forgottena bout. Dopamine has numerous important functions withint he body besides pleasure. The example I am usisng is its importance for the synthesis of adrenaline. Swim js read back and saw that You had used crack for at least one period of timen ot long before such an occurance. This need not be crack it oculd be any amphetamine, even methylphenidate, and sometimes even selective seratonin reuptake inhibitors, especially whent hey cause insomnia. Okay so bare with me here; The levels of dopamine are extraordinarly low here. This causes feelings of unrest, confusion, anxiety, and depression. (drop or add 1 depending on the individual). Now factor in the empty supply of adrenaline. This causes a state of panic and induces the fight or flight reaction. From here, if one has suffcient dopamine, then the anxiety attack would be more mild or perhaps even nonexistance. There is onelast factor to plug intot his equation however. This is that since dopamine is so low, and there is no adrenaline, new adrenaline cannot readily be made as the body needs. this cases two things to happen. One is constant states of panic ensue, for what would otherwise seem as 'for no apparent reason', as well as damage to the central nervous system from overexertion. Also extreme lethergy between fits of hysteria. This also reinforces the need for a downer and an upper such as the medicine you were on, even the one to battle the depression aforementioned. The downside is that left treated by standard tradional western medicine practices, the individuals entire body systemically becomes weaker. While attacking the CNS, the immune system become compromised. During this time, liver function begins to ween itself down slowly. Soon it will be overloaded and the lymph nodes will begin to clog up. All this means is that the lymph system is continuing collect the toxins it is supposed to, but is simply having trouble moving out such toxins. This will also add to the confusion, the hampered immune system, and the anxiety, as none of the drugs given will be fully filtered or excreted. From here pshychotic sysmptoms and parkinsons-like symptoms are the most common 'side effects', which are often diagnosed as seperate diseases, or as the progression of what had previously been diagnosed. Swim firmly beleives at least 1/3 of the documented cases of schitzophrenia are the result of this or something similar. Also remember that Antipsychotics have that uncanny effect of making people hallucinate. Therefore, simply put, your brain has been given new powers over your body. For example, if you have been fretting over things that could go wrong, for instance TD, and your brain is in a trance-liek hallucinating state, you could imagine the feelings an your body would actually feel them without the physical stimuli. This is very possible and most often times overlooked. Although this post was about TD, swim still feels this was relevant to the thread, and hopes it may prove to be useful to someone somwhere.
     
  15. FlyHigher

    FlyHigher Newbie

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    Re: seroquel has given Swim TD

    I agree that a tremor in the hands etc is probably not true Tardive dyskinesia. SWIM mentioned above about muscle rigidity and with adding the symptoms quoted in this post it was easy in hindsight to know my little pony had a SERIOUS case of TD. This was from taking 2 weeks worth of lithium at Doctor prescribed doses.

    With her mouth open and unable to swallow, so my pony was drooling everywhere, her jaw (and the muscles associated with jaw movement) became totally rigid and began jutting from one side of pony's mouth to the other in an AWFUL involuntary facial "grimace" Pony was absolutely terrified and I remember her putting her hands up to her jaw to try and push it back into place and it being absolutely impossible the area was so rigid.

    This is obviously not some "my Pony's TD was worse than your Pony's" competition, just my little Pony's experience with the full effects of Tardive dykenisia for those who are interested in knowing if they have a severe case or not. My pony's was a VERY severe case. Get your Pony medical treatment immediately if You begins experiencing the facial movements described to me by my little Pony.