Quickest Way To The Brain

Discussion in 'Pharmacology' started by pharmapsyche, Feb 12, 2006.

  1. pharmapsyche

    pharmapsyche AKA Miss Methylene Titanium Member

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    Smoking: Smoked or Inhaled drugs enter the lungs and are quickly absorbed into the bloodstream through tiny vessels lining the air sacs. Smoke is created when a material is vaporized under heat to form a gas. As the gas spreads into the cooler surrounding air, it condenses into microscopic liquid droplets. These droplets catch the light and appear as visible smoke. Because of the very small size of the droplets, much smaller than dust particles, inhaled smoke continues all the way to the lung air sacs, where it comes into contact with the bloodstream and is quickly absorbed. Blood from the lungs continues to the heart and some of it is pumped directly to the brain.
    TIME TO BRAIN: 7-10 seconds

    Injecting: This is the most direct way to take a drug, but surprisingly not as fast as smoking. There are several methods of using a needle to inject a drug. It may be injected to a vein, into a muscle, or deep into the skin. If the drug is injected into a vein, the blood first returns to the right side of the heart. It then is pumped to the lungs, returned to the left side of the heart, and then pumped into the brain. The other types of injection spread the drug into other tissues. Blood bathing these tissues will eventually pick up the drug, return it to the heart, lungs, and heart again, and then carry it to the brain.
    TIME TO BRAIN: 15-30 seconds if injected to a vein
    3-5 minutes if injected into muscle or skin

    Snorting: Drugs snorted into the nose are absorbed by blood vessels in the mucous membrans of the nasal passages. Although these blood bessels are very close to the brain, the drug-laden blood first returns to the heart, after which some of it is pumped back to reach the brain.
    TIME TO BRIAN: 3-5 minutes

    Contact: Some drugs can be absorbed directly through the skin, or mucous membranes in the eyes, mouth, vagina, or anus. Some people may take tiny LSD blotters and drop them into the space behind the lower eyelid, where the drug is rapidly absorbed. Liquid LSD can also be dropped into the eye, but this is seldom done.
    TIME TO BRAIN: 3-5 minutes
    15-30 minutes for skin and other areas

    Injesting: A drug that is eaten, drunk, or taken as a pill first passes down the esophagus to the stomach, where it is mixed with gastic fluids. It then moves on to the small intestine, where it is absorbed into the tiny blood vessels lining the walls. Intestinal blood goes to the liver, where the drug may be filtered out or altered. Blood from the liver then reaches the heart and is pumped to the brain. At any step along the way, the drug may be metabolized or degraded, making this method both the safest but also the slowest and least efficient way to take a drug.
    TIME TO BRAIN: 20-30 minutes
     
  2. Columbia U neuroscience

    Columbia U neuroscience Silver Member

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    finally someone i don't have to argue with...i have told so many people that smoking is about 2x faster than injecting and they never believe me...

    when you smoke it goes from the lungs and into the left side of the heart and to the brain

    when you inject it first into the right side of the heart which then proceeds to the lungs then through the left side of the heart then to the brain...

    yet when i explain this to them they don't seem to understand..
     
  3. EscapeDummy

    EscapeDummy Palladium Member

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    I agree that smoking reaches faster than the brain, what I am unclear on is why injecting is usually considered the "strongest" method. Is it higher bioavailability? Would someone smoking an opiate have it hit faster, but not harder, than IV?
     
  4. bean.

    bean. Titanium Member

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    All of the drug is in the blood stream when injected. However when you smoke not all of the drug passes through the endothelium of the alveoli, this is why many people hold down hits for as long as possible, as it allows time for the drug to diffuse into the blood.
     
  5. Ghetto_Chem

    Ghetto_Chem Palladium Member

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    To answer the question on why injection is still stronger.

    From what swim understands. When using any route BESIDES injection, there is a certain bioavailability and usually they are in the 25-35% range depending on the drug. Injections bioavailability is 100% as it bypasses all of the bodies defense barriers and such.

    Thats why although smoking crack will hit you faster. Shooting coke will make you feel like you just got blasted into space.

    Peace
     
  6. junky4life

    junky4life Newbie

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    15-30 seconds? i think more like 5-10 imo. my pet monkey has iv'd a lot of different drugs and the stimulants hit fastes and opiates hit slower maybe 10-15 seconds..heroin 10-15 as well this may be why some addicts are found with the needle still in their arm. just a thought and a response from one who knows his monkey well..
     
  7. Gdriussi

    Gdriussi Newbie

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    i agree totally. IV is 100% absorbed, whereas other methods, including smoking, result in a decreased blood serum level. most dedicated junky pets would trate the few minutes for rush for intensity.....though my monkey always felt impact pretty quickly, it seemed less than 5-10 min, but she wasn't timing it or anything.....

     
  8. alienesseINspace

    alienesseINspace Titanium Member

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    What are drugs people commonly use with the vagina for route of administration? Anyone done this?

    alienesseINspace added 357 Minutes and 33 Seconds later...

    I still want to know, has anyone taken anything vaginally and what? Does it work?
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2011
  9. Gdriussi

    Gdriussi Newbie

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    i've read about women doing it w/minimal satisfaction. i suspect that if it were more, or any, more of an effective ROA than those we read about, IV, IM, snorting, or plugging than we'd more, much more about it. theoretically it should work: mucus membranes and all that, but in practice it seems ineffective, from what i've read.
     
  10. psyche

    psyche Palladium Member

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    In the late middle ages, alleged witches used to rub the ointment made out of belladonna in their vaginal cavities with brooms. This induced the feeling of flying. That is why witches fly with brooms. That is effective probably because tropane alkaloids found in belladonna are active at sub-milligram doses.
     
  11. Liltony420

    Liltony420 Newbie

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    You could inject it into your neck, particularily the gugular. 100% availability, time to brain <5sec... Just sayin...

    (Obviously dont do this and if you do, dont sue me cuz i just said you shouldnt!)

    Liltony420 added 3 Minutes and 34 Seconds later...

    And smoking dissolves it into your mucous lining where it then transfer into your blood. And you breath some out also.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2012
  12. corvardus

    corvardus Gold Member

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    You mean the Carotid artery? The Jugular, being a vein, should be returning to the heart, then lungs before having a chance to re-enter the systemic circulation.

    Unless I am mistaken, the time to onset in the brain would be greater than smoking and normal injection. Arterial injection would be bad news and the following pdf reiterates the point that one should not perform injections into arteries or into areas of the body where the veins and arteries are in close, spatial, proximity (i.e. the neck)

    Complications After Unintentional Intra-arterial Injection of Drugs:
    Risks, Outcomes, and Management Strategies
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 11, 2012
  13. Mindless

    Mindless Gold Member Donating Member

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    I often hear that IV injections in the neck are to be discouraged as they present an unacceptably high risk. I thought it would be worth finding out why this is the case, and came across this on routes of administration:

    Self injecting in the neck is extremely dangerous, difficult to do and should be strongly discouraged. Arteries, veins, tendons and nerves are all very close together.
    Part of the risk arises from the fact that for self injectors, self injection in the neck requires the use of a mirror. This difficulty may lead injectors to ask others to attempt neck injection for them, thereby increasing the chances of both viral transmission and local injury, and removing all personal control over the process.

    The common complications of neck injecting may be similar to those in other areas, such as cellulitis and abscess formation, but have even more devastating effects. An abscess or cellulitis in the neck can cause dangerous pressure on nerves or obstruct the airway.

    • Accidental injection into an artery, if this occurs, then the drug and any other matter contained in the solution will go directly to the brain, potentially causing a range of neurological problems, including strokes
    • Aneurysm (weakening of a blood vessel wall)
    • Nerve damage, including vocal chord paralysis.”
    Source: Preventing unnecessary vein damage: a briefing paper for those working with injecting drug users by Paul Hardacre, Andrew Preston and Jon Derricott 2003.

    So please don't try this for yourself. There is a risk of nerve damage, tendon damage, abscesses, neurological problems and strokes, and aneurysm. There is an additional risk of internal jugular vein thrombosis, with complications such as 'systemic sepsis, chylothorax, papilledema, airway edema, and pulmonary embolism.' (Internal Jugular Vein Thrombosis Dale K Mueller, MD 2011 Medscape). There is also a small risk of potentially fatal infection of deep soft tissues in the neck. (Infection of deep soft tissues of the neck in intravenous drug abuse Schondorf J, et al 2000 PMID:10763176).
     
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  14. Gdriussi

    Gdriussi Newbie

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    only specially licensed technicians/Dr.s would even attempt, let along be legally allowed, to attempt a jugular injection or IV line..... this is my experience, and it seems logical. DO NOT attempt this yourself.
     
  15. fehs

    fehs Silver Member

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    I have to agree here, 15-30 is too long at least for stimulants, ~3-10 seconds would probably be closer to truth. For example, I can often feel a speed shot before I'm even finished shooting, I mean even if it's a "hole-in-one" shot, like I don't waste time re-registering or the needle doesn't slip off the vein or anything like that.

    Dunno about full agonist opiates/opioids myself, got really limited experience with them by IV. I've done couple shots of heroin in ~1998-1999, but I don't remember the speed of onset _that_ well.

    Also, I noticed that one of the greatest ROA's there is when it comes to speed of onset and bioavailability, plugging, is not included in the OP. Fast onset (in about the same ballpark than IM and intranasal, if not faster) and very high bioavailability (don't quote me on this, but I think around 90-95% for most drugs?).
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2012
  16. nanodesu

    nanodesu Newbie

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    Heroin has a slower onset because it's a prodrug, so enzymes in the blood need to make it active first.

    Plugging is a surprisingly good method. The bioavailability is high, because there's no first-pass metabolism.
     
  17. meth_latex_catsuit_doll

    meth_latex_catsuit_doll Silver Member

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    Definitely. Plugging is known for its direct expedited delivery to the bloodstream. It's SWIM's only ROA for Ritalin, Dexedrine and Adderall. Ritalin rectally is in the order of 97% and onset within 90 seconds.

    Equally efficient for both therapeutically and recreational use, depending on dosage. Very safe too.

    meth_latex_catsuit_doll added 77 Minutes and 39 Seconds later...

    Plugging can indeed be ineffective under certain conditions, such as the presence of fecal matter blocking or interfering with absorption. It's therefore desirable to ensure the rectum cavity is clean and the bowel is empty before squirting up the bum.

    Another thing to consider is that regular booty servings, builds up tolerance very quickly and effects fade.

    That's why it's important to go easy on the plunger.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2012
  18. misskatie

    misskatie Titanium Member

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    Glad someone brought up plugging :) its AFOAFs favorite ROA. She is yet to find a drug that doesnt work well when plugged and the onset is indeed very quick :)
     
  19. Mindless

    Mindless Gold Member Donating Member

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    I thought you might like this, it gives a good rationale for plugging as an alternative to IV use:

    "The functions of the rectum are to store faeces and reabsorb fluid in order to prevent dehydration. It has an excellent supply of blood in order to carry out this function, and this means that any fluid introduced to the rectum is quickly absorbed.

    It can provide for very rapid uptake of the drug (almost as fast as injecting), although not everyone finds this to be the case. In some opiate users the cause of this may be constipation and absorption of the drug by faeces.

    The method is simple: the needle is removed from the syringe (essential!), then the tip of the syringe is inserted into the rectum, and the plunger depressed. It can be suggested as a route of last resort in the event of not being able to find anywhere to inject which is much better than just sticking the needle in anywhere and injecting into the muscle.

    It can also give injectors the ritual of drug preparation without the delay of fruitless attempts to find a vein, and slow absorption when they miss."

    So plugging can be almost as fast as IV injecting. This is probably one of the quicker contact routes of administration that pharmapsyche refers to, taking 3-5 minutes to reach the brain.

    Source:
    Preventing unnecessary vein damage: a briefing paper for those working with injecting drug users
    by Paul Hardacre, Andrew Preston and Jon Derricott 2003

    The full document can be seen here: https://drugs-forum.com/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&catid=153&id=11341
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 10, 2017
  20. misskatie

    misskatie Titanium Member

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    Haha AFOAF can confirm that she does indeed enjoy the whole 'ritual' of plugging :)

    By the way, an oral syringe will suffice for this ROA also, which is pretty much ready to go. As you state there Mindless if your bowels are 'unclean' then you may end up just pushing your goodies into poop so a bowel movement beforehand is usually a good idea :)