Addiction - Resetting a Kratom tolerance

Discussion in 'Kratom' started by ytrel, Apr 8, 2010.

  1. ytrel

    ytrel Newbie

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    SWIM searched these forums, but didn't find too much about how long a tolerance stays with SWIeveryone. So many different backgrounds and usage habits.

    I have been using heavily for a few days. Today he took 12 grams of Indo and Thai (6 of each), and another dose of about 5 grams of Thai 45 minutes later. 3 hours later, he saw what he had left and it was only about 2 teaspoons of Indo, so he went ahead and dosed that other 6 grams, so that is 23 grams total for the day. (Way more than ever before, max before was probably 12 grams in a day, MAYBE 15).

    He is abstaining tomorrow, but has plans in 2 days to take Kratom with a swimmer. He has never felt any inkling of withdrawal, although the last day he took off was 4 days ago. He's not worried about abstaining tomorrow.

    He's worried that this one episode may have ruined his chances of having a good time with 10-12 grams of Thai in 2 days time. But he doesn't want to dose too much more than that, because he is only getting 1 oz and wants to split it with a swimmer.

    SWIM supposes he'll find out soon enough, but he's wondering if he should up his order now, scrape together the funds, or if 10-12 grams will retain its usual pleasure after such a megafest today.

    Any thoughts would be helpful.
     
  2. ianzombie

    ianzombie Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Tolerance is something that seems to change from person to person.
    In My experience when he first started using Kratom a couple of days off between use would keep his tolerance at bay so long as he was not using any more than 15 - 20 grams a day.
    The more he used the more time he needed between doses to let his tolerance come back down.

    One thing I have found is that after long term daily use, 6 months+ its taken Swim weeks to get his tolerance back down to how it was at the start. I have quit, gone through withdrawals which lasted in some form for 4 week and then tried Kratom again only to find he still had some tolerance issues.

    A warning that Swim will give is that in his experience withdrawals symptoms have not materialised until toward the end of the second day after stopping. This might not be typical for most people but it should be kept in mind just in case You thinks that after one day without any wd symptoms they are addiction free.
     
  3. semaj

    semaj Silver Member

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    in my experience, since You hasnt been a daily user, tolerance should come down fairly quickly, but like swizombie said, everyone is different.

    In swims early days of kratom when he wasnt using everyday, one day off was enough to reset tolerance close to where it was prior.

    having just one big dosing day, then taking a day off, should help a good bit. but keep in mind not every kratom experience is going to be the same. Some days the same amount will make You feel energized, others more relaxed, other days little to nothing.

    sounds like You is still in early days, keep it spaced out and You will be able to enjoy swiy's experiences with kratom more
     
  4. Jasim

    Jasim Gold Member

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    This is for any drug where tolerance is an issue, but Clover has noticed it particularly with any opiate agonists:
    Tolerance will go away with a short period of abstinence, but can return quickly upon resumed dosing. To truly reset a high tolerance, at least 2 months abstinence should be taken. If dosing after this period of abstinence, be wary of tolerance returning quickly, if it does then a longer period of abstinence is required to reset the tolerance.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2010
  5. ytrel

    ytrel Newbie

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    Thank you. That's all great information for SWIM. Basically, he doesn't really mind a small tolerance, but would like a 10g dose to remain effective. If he ever lost effectiveness at 10g, he thinks he'd just make himself quit for a while. Mostly because money is always an issue, but also, 10g for him is an intense dose and he'd like it to stay that way.

    That said, he usually doses a 7.5 gram dose, then 45 minutes later takes another 2.5 grams. This, for him, lengthens the overall experience by, he guesses, 45 minutes! Anyway thats a nice chunk of time, and although it builds slightly slower that way, the initial 7.5 g does a really nice number on him initially.

    He isn't sure how long this type of dose will remain effective, which is why he wants to take a day or two away from kratom. It's hard though, because now it's looking straight at him from the cabinet every time he wants to grab a dish. Which is actually pretty often. The shipment came a bit early
     
  6. Jasim

    Jasim Gold Member

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    Hide it somewhere You won't see it all the time. And yea, that dose level won't last too long unless You is very careful. Good luck, this is something swiAll have had to deal with at some point.
     
  7. ytrel

    ytrel Newbie

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    SWIM wonders if a daily change in strain-usage might help against the buildup of the tolerance.. probably not though. He's happy to have taken a day off, maybe he needs even more time. He's going to hide the kratom.
     
  8. iostream.h

    iostream.h Newbie

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    SWIM began using kratom a month or so ago, and decided based on his research to limit his usage to only once per week. Unfortunately, he's reported that even when strictly holding to that schedule (no cheating) he's needed more of the powder each week to get the same effects. He's been using the enhanced bali extract, and is now up to almost 3x the amount used in week 1, although it's still only about 5-7 grams split across 3 cups of tea.

    He'd been hoping that this was actually infrequent enough usage that a tolerance would not build, but apparently even once per week is enough to gain tolerance.

    Now I am considering sitting out of the game for two weeks to try again and see if his tolerance is reset.
     
  9. squidaway

    squidaway Newbie

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    I have been using Kratom quite frequently lately. After revisiting this drug about 3 months ago it quickly turned to everyday use.

    Back then, the first dose he did was 7g, which put him in a nice on-the-floor-smiling type high.
    Yesterday SWIM dosed about 25g thru the day and noone could have known he was on anything.

    Today I haven't had any Kratom at all, and he isnt really feeling to good. He didnt get any work done today and is feeling rather depressed.

    Next time I will have any kratom will be in about one week, so he will (if he remembers) post back on how his tolerance is then.

    I think this will be a GREAT week! :D
     
  10. Maudlin_Fame

    Maudlin_Fame Silver Member

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    I have generally found that having numerous moderate doses throughout the day seems to build tolerance quicker than a single larger dose per day. Is this something others have experienced as well?

    Be sure to keep us posted on how Swiy's tolerance alters after one week.:thumbsup:
     
  11. DXMBunny

    DXMBunny Silver Member

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    I have to agree that one large dose seems to not build much tolerance, but multi dosing tends to lead to high tolerance, and quicker withdrawals.
    When I used once a day, WD's never seemed to show tell couple days later, once I went to multi use a day, he got withdrawals the next morning and sometimes even the same day if he did not dose.

    a few days off does wonders, and a few weeks to months can reset tolerance. It may never be like the first time, but one could go from 4g a dose to .5 - 1g a dose with a small break. some people can take a few days off and achieve a cut in half tolerance(my experience) some it may take a couple weeks or a couple months.

    One must test their own way. no other way to know, each person is different. good luck to swimmers!
     
  12. Jasim

    Jasim Gold Member

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    Does anyone have any experience using naltrexone to quickly reset kratom tolerance? I'm guessing a week on naltrexone should be able to completely wipe out any kratom tolerance and fully reset it.
     
  13. onzero

    onzero Titanium Member

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    yeah basically with opiates you get a "honeymoon period" which can last years depending on DOC and usage patterns... during this period tolerance doesn't seem to rapidly go up, especially on weaker pharms like codeine, hydrocodone, tramadol, kratom, etc... (i know kratom isn't a pharm)

    for swim that period lasted over 3 years, during his first 3 years of opiate use, I could reliably get high on a single 10mg vicodin... you know nothing mind-bending but a bold and welcomed euphoria, actually swim preferred low dosages especially of drugs like vicodin and tramadol, and the occasional percocet...

    but eventually I could only come across morphine... and once that happened, which is regrettable since he didnt' even enjoy it as much as hydrocodone, his tolerance went up dramatically, now even several 10mg vicodin don't seem to do anything very obvious, almost no high present, little euphoria, feels more like a mood-boost than getting high.

    even before the morphine however, I noticed substantially diminished effects from hydrocodone developing rather quickly after 3 years of use (use would be characterized as every 3-4 days, sometimes 2-3 days in a row.
     
  14. DXMBunny

    DXMBunny Silver Member

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    DXM seems to help reverse tolerance, for swim it seemed to double up his reversal. So I would use it first day, and it felt like he just had two days off. so one may want to try that, be safe and read up on it, sorry swim can not post more right now, but if one has questions, I will check up on this thread.
     
  15. Jasim

    Jasim Gold Member

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    I always thought DXM acted kind of like buprenorphine by partially blocking the opiate effects with a less effective agonist. Though that's based on assumption. It is known that DXM usage in low doses does cause a slowing in the onset of tolerance, much the way buprenorphine does, but I don't think it will prevent a tolerance increase after an extended period of chronic use.

    Anyway, anyone have any sources on this? It's worthwhile looking into especially considering DXM is typically easy to obtain.
     
  16. onzero

    onzero Titanium Member

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    DXM has been proven to reduce the onset of tolerance to opiates.

    There is actually a hydrocodone/DXM combination medication being developed for this reason. For swim taking DXM kinda ruins the opiate high, but it does work for slowing the onset of tolerance fairly dramatically. Interestingly melatonin was also found to do the same thing, something about interfering with nitric oxide production.
     
  17. Jasim

    Jasim Gold Member

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    That correlates with what I was saying.

    Melatonin slows onset of tolerance with opiates??? Source please, anyone? And what's the relationship with nitric oxide production???
     
  18. DXMBunny

    DXMBunny Silver Member

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    If one reads the faq on dxm White's preferably, they will see an article explaining how DXM has been used in studies, for people going through withdrawals, to help prevent and reverse Tolerance, and also preventing and eliminating opiate withdrawal, google William white faq or dxm faq, also just google dxm for opiate tolerance, I do not have time sorry. But simple searches will prove fruitful, many studies on the two together.
     
  19. squidaway

    squidaway Newbie

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    I had two days of feeling like shit after stopping kratom use.
    On the third day he was actually feeling rather good.

    And when to his surprise the kratom arrived the evening of the third day, rather than after a whole week as he had planned I was actually a little hesitant to dose again.
    Tho about ten minutes later he made some brew :crazy

    Tolerance seemed lower, maybe even halved at that moment. But now some days later I am back at about 25 a day :vibes:
     
  20. arizona79

    arizona79 Silver Member

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    Man, once my ferret got her hands on some morphine, nothing and she means NOTHING has ever hit the spot like that since. She has come to enjoy kratom more than most opiates though- it's cheaper, more available, legal, doesn't make her as cranky on comedown, etc.

    As for the tolerance issue, my ferret usually takes a day off from usage in between 4oz orders, and she usually switches up the type of kratom each 4oz, sometimes ordering an ounce or two of something else with those 4oz. She's found that switching the types helps reduce the tolerance. She's been basically a daily-user for over a year and this method has generally worked out well for her.