Restoring memory/ cognitive function

Discussion in 'Ecstasy & MDMA' started by Rach, Mar 18, 2004.

  1. Rach

    Rach Newbie

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    I have postedrecently about my post 'e' problems with depression,memory loss and the general negativeeffects of whatever Iingested on my overall mental wellbeing. Over the past two months I have contacted various individuals involved with MDMA research and also harm reductionconcerning recreational drugs, detailing my current situation. All werein agreement that the substance that I took was not MDMA but some other adulterant. (DXM/Methamphetamine possibly but who the f**k knows, I don't).


    I'm well aware that whatever I took is well out of my system now but unfortunatelyI'm still left withthelingering effects.However things are starting to improve for me. It could be just be the start of Spring but I am starting to pick up each day. I quit the Prozac because it did not help in the slightest and just gave me f***d up muscle twitches and a fuzzy head. At the moment I'm taking 5HTP and vitamins B6 and B12 and eating more God damn fruit than you could shake a stick at. Both vitamins(B6+B12) are essential for healthy functioning of the brain,and so far they seem to be helping.


    However I've just ordered online Piracetam and Choline (Nootropics)supplements. Both are supposed to be excellent in aiding memory and cognitive functioning. I have heard glowing reports and am keeping my fingers well and truly crossed that they wrap my brain up in gift wrap and deliver it duly. Piracetam is only available by prescription in the Uk but I've ordered online from the cheeky Yanks.They have no knownserious side effects,although they should not be taken with amphetamines.


    Jesus Christ, I want my sense of humour and the ability to enjoy myself back but moreso I want my intelligence back. I'm sick of forgetting my train of thought when I'm halfway through a conversation. (Piracetam is also supposed to help with drug resistantdepression). Look it up.


    Any other ideas v. welcome
     
  2. Tweak

    Tweak Newbie

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    My sister has recently obtained a herbal 'Bush Remedy' called 'Cognis', which is supposed to restore cognitive brain function and help stimulate damaged brain cells...

    Or something like that, shes into the whole natural aromatherapy, hippy shit but she says it works good.

    I have seen her after 10 drops of it, she is really buzzing and is very alert/awake and uses it to complete her homework! <img border="0" src= "smileys/smiley4.gif">

    I will do some more research on it because It seems to be very popular in Australia...
     
  3. Gareth

    Gareth Silver Member

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    If you think you might be suffering from Olney's lesions, DON'T PANIC. You may just have depleted neurotransmitters, or induced long-term (but reversible) changes to neuroreceptor function. If you feel you are impaired, STOP USING NOW, and stay clean for several months before you get worried. Many people have told me that their "brain damage" cleared up after a few months.



    http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs.old/synthetics/dxm/dissociative .brain.damage.html


    I pray that's what you and I have got.
     
  4. Gareth

    Gareth Silver Member

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    I find that rediculous amounts of stimulants helps. it doesnt bring me to the same plane of thought that I used to get out of it but it's pretty close/little better than I used to feel normally. I bought some of that piracetam as well. Have you heard of centrophenoxine? Also supposed to help a lot
     
  5. LuvsToSmokeDust

    LuvsToSmokeDust Newbie

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    ^ ^ See a shrink. If you don't have the money theres shrinks at the free clinics that can hook you up.

    Believe it or not coffee with cigarettes and 10mg.s of valium three times a day does the trick for me.

    Don't like to smoke ? Use a nicotine patch.

    Although amphetamines seem like there doing the job, in the long run amphetamines will impair the memory. Plus if it is something like Olney's lesions the risk of amphetamine psychosis is much higher if your using a amphetamine or amphetamine like stimulant, Ritalin for example, to improve your memory.
     
  6. Gareth

    Gareth Silver Member

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    Rach, this may be little consolation right now, but I feel like I'm getting a little better. My memory, understanding (especially spacial), motor-function and communication skills (I couldnt talk to my friends or parents now for a good week now) have all started to improve. I may just be getting used to the feeling but I really dont think it's just that.


    My take on E is this (and I think the theory has been backed up):


    It's exponentially dose related. That means taking 200mg of MDMA is far more than twice as damaging as taking 100mg. I have no doubt what I took was a very strong dose, and I've experienced some scary after-effects. It's been 10/11 days now.I can confidently sayit'll probablytake another month or two before I feel nothing (I pray). But I guess what I'm saying is, taking those two pills (assuming they were just MDMA, I know your doubts), could just take much longer to diminish. Perhaps my pill had 150/200mg. Assuming yours was just a double dose, say 300mg, those effects may stay with you for much longer, but you WILL feel right eventually. It may take a year, but you'll live through it and return to normal, safe in the knowledge that you are a whole lot more wise to drugs. As I said to myself, I may have just continued taking them had it not been for this experience.


    Refer to my post (I know the rules, I think this is very pertinent. Delete it if you will, I'd just like it to be here as my story). It sums up how I feel. I hope you feel the same way:


    Where to start? I guess I'll start at that horrible night, 9 days ago.

    It was a saturday night and a few friends and I thought it would be great to head over to a night club in the city. Most of us were taking herbal pills that night, legal alternatives that increase stamina or sensual perception, depending on what the pill was. I, however, decided to try ecstacy again. It was the third time, and both times previous to this, my night had been amazing. I would later learn that the doses those other two times had been much weaker. Upon arriving at the club, everyone took their pills with the exception of me and a friend of mine who was going to buy them from a third-party at around 2am. I took an energy pill and started having a great time. 2.30 rolled round and it was time. Downed the whole thing and just waited for it to kick in. I thought dancing a little more would speed up the process so I went and stood under a strobe light and let things progress. 30-40 minutes later I started to feel the familiar warm, soothing sensation. It was great. There wasn't a suddent rush like last time, or so I thought. Unfortunately, the train left the trippy platform I wanted to stop off at and just kept going. I started to feel incredibly motion-sick. 20 minutes form there it all went downhill. I threw up a couple of time and decided to spend a while near the toilet because both times were narrow misses. I think I was actually dancing in the cubicle. I managed to scare my friends a bit as well (understandable). After a while I left and just stayed sitting in a chair till closing at 7.15. My friends were well and trully down but amazingly I was still floating on air. Half of me wanted to feeling to subside, the other half liked it. Many thoughts went through my mind. Should I go to hospital? Is there a way to stop the trip? Am I making an idiot of myself? We left the club and walked up the street to my friends car where we drove home and lay down on some couches for a good few hours without being able to sleep. All the while I was still (no kidding), buzzing out. 10am came around and I felt what must have been the end of an incredibly slow come-down. I still felt some residual effects but I thought this was normal. After a little bad sleep that night I awoke the next morning to symptoms that still persisted. I just lay down (luckily had planned a couple weeks off work earlier) and tried to focus on shaking the feeling.

    8 days down the road and things aren't looking much better. I've tried to categorize myself, what I feel, but it's hard. This has been the most harrowing and petrifying event of my entire life. From this day forward I will never touch another drug. I even swore off alcohol but since then I have had a few beers. I've been spending almost all of my time just searching the internet for clues. I know ecstacy can cause long-term damage now, but I had never heard of it before. Even then it seemed to be from people with a prolonged use of the substance. I feel as thought I'm still on a mild trip. I'll try to detail every symptom I can:

    - Sensation of touch. This was the most pronounced. It took me, and still does, longer to understand what it is that I'm touching. My braing responds slower somehow, possibly from a lack of the feeling itself. My skin doesn't seem to respond like it used to. It almost feels like someone elses skin. This has manifested itself in everything I do. From typing, to eating, to just using the remote control on the television (and believe me, I've been watching a lot to get my mind off things). My coordination is far worse, although not nearly as noticeably from someone else's perspective. I feel myself losing balance far more easily that I would. Everything feels.... different, new. I feel like I'm learning to walk again. It's just taking much longer than the first time around.

    - Sight. I process everything I'm seeing much slower than I used to. Everything has a slight disorientational effect. Not quite real. It takes me longer to process what it is that I'm actually seeing.

    - Sound. I've been experiencing strange sound distortions, similar to what I experienced that night. Turning my head, for instance, while talking, or talking near an object makes me perceive sound, especially my own voice, in a while new way. Sound normally changes slightly when near an object, and normally the brain filters this and says "yes, different, but normal". It doesn't seem to be working as effectively. Some sounds are much louder than they should be (notably me chewing or using my mouth). Others are much softer, like talking to someone. I can't uderstand what they're saying to me unless they pronounce clearly and slowly. I really need to pay serious attention to anything someone is talking about or I completely miss the subject material.

    - Taste. I remember riding my suzuki bike to the shops a few days after this and buying a drink. I thought it was mango flavour (the colour was right, as was the packaging, just a different flavour). I just didnt pick up the huge 'apple' on the front. I started drinking it and had NO IDEA i wasn't drinking mango. I just drank it. For some reason I looked at the label and there it was, apple. I could now distinguish the difference. I in fact don't like apple, and those familiar feelings of dislike came back. I finished drinking it anyway, but it didn't taste nearly as good. Taste has been dulled. Yet maybe just the normal process of my brain telling me exactly what it is I'm tasting has been dulled. I can still distinguish the way I used to if I try. This is linked with my ability to smell anything. The problem is the same. I get confused easily.

    - Processing speed. This has been a big problem for now. This may tie in all of the above. I can't process things at the speed I used to. I could focus incredibly sharply if I really wanted to. Not so now. Because of this, everything in my life has been affected (ie right there, I just wrote 'affects' without even knowing). It's as if my conscious mind has been dulled. I've just lost 15 IQ points. I feel that intelligence still there behind everything, but I can't extract it like I used to. My concentration is far far worse. I'm almost behind a curtain of dumbness. Everything moves slower now.

    - Memory. This and processing speed have been my far the worst to deal with. I can handle living in a world that feels alien. But when my mind is different, when I'm a different person, and I interpret things differently, respond differently, understand, communicate, memorise, act, and feel differently, this scares the hell out of me. I just don't feel like me anymore and I hate it more than you could ever imagine. It feels like my memory has gone out the window, but with examination it's hard to tell if that's because I'm unable to focus as well as I used to. Sure I 'can' memorise things, it just seems like with much more difficulty. I have always had a problem with random names, places, events. I just can't tell if what I'm experiencing now is an after-effect. Talking with people if much more difficult. I don't respond the way I used to and sometimes when I concentration isn't at it's peak I respond with odd and uncharacteristic things. Like a tape player, reciting things it knows it should, just at the wrong time. My mind is retrieving the wrong data. I just don't know how to relate the way I used to, and present the same empathy. I forget what it was I was saying sometimes in the middle of things. This has happened several times in this post already.

    I think that's it. The more I read about others's problems, the more I feel I have some of them. I've been told not to read for fear of the placebo effect. However, I've always been incredibly objective with any information I handle. I can step outside myself and look at me from another persons perspective. So I think the fear of materialising a condition on myself is low. I do, however, realise that I have changed, and so to, perhaps, my ability to be objective. The scary thing is I can relate so well to so much of what has been identified. I don't know if I have none, some, or all of the problems detailed in the information I have read.

    This is my take on things. Sometimes it helps, sometimes it seem stupid, but here goes:

    I HAVE rearranged my neural pathways. I've done so in a way that my mind is still trying to make sense of it. The ecstacy has linked parts of my brain that shouldn't have been linked. Maybe because my mind is trying to make sense of what it was that I felt. Maybe...probably because I've destroyed some links that should have remained intact. I feel as though my seratonin system was always quite weak. I have suffered from depression earlier in life but was able to overcome it by training my mind to work in a different way. I'm strong-willed, but the idea of changing who I am, or destroying some brain cells really doesn't glue with my philosophy on life. Right now my brain is working overtime on repairing missing links. In doing so, it's overwriting old material, taking routes it hasn't taken before, and using areas that have never been used for specific tasks before. This has caused HUGE conflict in the way I perceive things, and the way I act. For all I know, because I smoked (cigarettes) so much during that night, my mind may now be hardwired to smoke for the rest of my life (just an example, I don't think I feel that way). I'm trying to understand just how much of the brain really needs to be there before one notices a difference. Different sections are responsible for different things, and I'm trying to understand if I've selectively destroyed sections (resulting in this selective criteria of symptoms), or if in doing what I've done, it has a follow-on effect with all the other regions. Possibly a little of both. Now comes the fun part: can other regions be used to do the same task? Is my mind strong enough to use other sections and compensate for what I've done? Only time with tell. But one thing's for sure. I KNOW that I have reserves. There is so much of my mind I haven't even begun to tap. There's plenty of space up there, I just have to consciously will myself to repair everything they way I want it to be repaired. The mind responds to things YOU do. It will change depending on how YOU think. You can reprogram your entire mind, your entire being with what YOU think and do. If this is the case, I have so much more left up there, I just have to make sure I use ot properly and connect everything up the way I want it to be connected.

    The effects I feel are a mild form of exactly what it was I felt that night. And listening to everyone else on this forum, it seems that they are experiencing the same thing. Our minds have been shocked so much that it believes what it experiences was reality and adjusted to it. Possibly from one event, possibly from many strong events.

    I would give anything to go back with the knowledge I have now and change that horrible night. In some respects, it has been a lesson. If I had had a good night I probably would have continued using ecstacy occasionally, changing myself in small ways again and again and never realising. I now know the dangers of any and all drugs. It has been one of the biggest learning experiences of my life. I'm glad I learned the lesson (of course it had to be the hard bloody way.... that's just me). I could, I supposed, have done far more damage. I guess I can learn to live this way if I have to. I really f***ing dont want to though. I will be doing everything I can to repair this wonderful organ of mine. I feel it is unique. Not in the way that everyone if unique, in the way that it is far off from what I believe is the norm. My ideas are always set in concrete, but I haveā€¦..had an ability to move that concrete at will. I was hardwired to every task. I think I take after my father, and I'm grateful for the way I am. It has given me a strength and commitment in the past that I have never known someone to possess. I do believe, and this is hard for me to admit, that I became too hardwired into everyday life. Maybe what has happened to me is an opportunity to restart the learning curve. I have the knowledge of my combined 19 years on this planet, but now I can retrain the way I want my mind to work. I have the flexibilty of a 10 year old's mind, with the experience of a 19 year old. I WILL WIN, THERE IS NO QUESTION. BUT TO WHAT DEGREE THAT VICTORY IS I DONT KNOW. I can live with everything else if only my conscious mind will speed up again. Stimulants are helping. It probably isn't the best way to do it, but it reminds me of who I really am, or maybe 'was' now.

    Everyone's mind is an open canvas. The older you get, the harder it is to write on it, but it's still possible. Only YOU can change what's up there. If you truly want to feel good, all you have to do is focus on it and make the change. It just takes dedication, commitment, and belief.

    I was just about to apologise for such a long post. No. I hope if you've got this far you take something away with you. It's just my story and my opinion, but I think it applies to everyone here. It feels good to write down everything I've been thinking and feeling so far. Thanks for reading.


    One last thing. So far I've only been to a general practitioner and he's informed me to go home and wait it out for another couple of weeks.

    1) Has anyone else experienced a lingering after-effect that can last for several weeks (this is NO depression, this is a serious feeling of being outside of myself, I've lost much fine motor-skill among other things)? This was caused by ecstacy, but I'd be interested in hearing from anyone with a similar experience from other drugs.

    2) Do any of the effects I've described sound like HPPD? I understand the definitions described in other sections of the forum, and they pertain to mainly visual effects. But it also details that the 'filter' part of the brain (that responsible for filtering 'senses') has been damaged. My 'senses' have been effected, including sight. I don't 'see' things though, probably because what I took didn't cause large hallucinations.

    Thanks again.Edited by: Alfa
     
  7. Neo1

    Neo1 Newbie

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    Two natural nutrients that may help prevent post-E serotonin depletion
    are Tryptophan (or 5-hydroxy-tryptophan) and Alpha-lipoic acid:







    Plus, alpha-lipoic acid is a damn fine nutrient, a great antioxidant
    and (to go a bit off-topic) in conjunction with acetyl-l-carnitine, a
    good anti-aging combo :)



    Peace,

    Neo

    </font>
     
  8. Tony Blair

    Tony Blair Newbie

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    Useful info, thanks Neo1..
     
  9. Ximot

    Ximot Newbie

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    Tryptophan is banned in the US though, due to the deaths related to a badly manufactured batch from Japan years ago.
    Although that had nothing to do with the tryptophan itself. Perhaps one (inofficial) reason for the ban was the material's effectiveness as an SSRI, liek przac without any nasty side effects.

    But it is a precursor to 5-htp, which is available... or you can order tryptophan from europe . . .
     
  10. Neo1

    Neo1 Newbie

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    Well it's interesting to note that prozac was released witin a week of tryptophan being banned. Hmmmmmmmm [​IMG]
     
  11. ThirdEyeFloond

    ThirdEyeFloond Platinum Member & Advisor

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    from denmark
    Vasopressin or Antidiuretic Hormone commonly sold as Diapid should have
    great inpact on drug-induced memory problems. A few puffs of a
    nasalspray should 'clear the cloud' in seconds.

    Look in Erowids Vasopressin vault for further info
     
  12. hippie_lain

    hippie_lain Gold Member

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    Theirs a SSRI called lexapro that works really well for me after doing lots of E. If you stop doing ALL drugs and take it you might fell like your old self again. Worked great for me, not like prozac at all
     
  13. mucus

    mucus Newbie

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    hey gareth, i find myself in the same situation.

    i see your post is 7 yo, how did your issue evolve? did you get back to normal?
     
  14. chocolatecake

    chocolatecake Newbie

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    u should be fine. just keep working on it.
    u should just get back on track. you have to release a few things. you will make mistakes.
    u will correct them.
    you will practice and practice.
    then one day you will smile and feel proud of yourself.
    good luck

    chocolatecake added 2 Minutes and 39 Seconds later...

    not "release" a few things but "relearn"
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2012