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Dose - Strongest OTC sedative without unwanted side effects?

Discussion in 'Downers and sleeping pills' started by Green Xenon, Oct 5, 2011.

  1. Green Xenon

    Green Xenon

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    Hi:

    I live in Diamond Bar of Southern Califonia, USA.

    What is the most potent and longest-lasting OTC sedative [taken in pill form] that does not cause -- or intensify -- any of the following at the maximum non-toxic dose for a 27-year-old adult male:

    1. Hypertension
    2. Rhabdomyolysis [breakdown of muscle tissues, such that which can be caused by doxylamine succinate]
    3. Issues relating to the urinary system

    What is the maximum non-toxic dose of this chemical?

    I'm looking for a OTC substance that is both intense and long-lasting. Something that will put me out instantly and last for a minimum of 24 hours without causing any permanent trauma to any part of the body or causing any of the above 3 side effects at the given dosage.

    I also have an un-related question. What is the maximum dosage of doxylamine succinate that will not cause rhabdomyolysis in a 27-year-old man?


    Thanks,

    GX
     
  2. staples

    staples Gold Member

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    Rhabdomyolysis has been reported in cases of doxylamine overdose approaching lethal doses (20+ 25mg pills from the cases I can find). This should not be a concern unless your ulterior motive is a Darwin Award (in fact, one case report seemed to be a suicide attempt).

    A minimum of 24 hours, OTC, and without side effects!? Do you mind if I ask what you are trying to achieve? Regardless, the short answer is: no.
     
  3. Green Xenon

    Green Xenon

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    It's my crazy way of losing weight on the days I have off.

    If I'm too sleepy to eat, I won't. So my body will be forced to use fat for energy. I can get lost in my thoughts.

    What will happens if I take 4 doxylamine succinate pills [25 mg each] for two days in the morning. Since I don't have tasks on the given days, I won't need to be awake. 100 mg of doxy each morning for two days should keep me asleep so that I don't eat anything on those two days. On the day after the second day I have a social event I need to attend. On that day, I plan to fast as well. On the next day I plan to have a protein drink whose only calories are from 40g of protein -- no carbs. Of course, must include my vitamin pills.

    After 3 days, I think my appetite would disappear and I would no longer need sleeping pills. So I would just keep drinking the protein drink along with some vitamin pills. I've read about fasting and that after 3 days, your hunger disappears. Following this phase, I can just have one meal a day, which is the protein drink. The protein drink has only 160 calories, so this would be a very-low-calories versions of the "induction" phase of the Atkins diet. This will force my body to start using fat for energy. When I reach my ideal body weight, I stop this routine and start eating "real" but healthy food.

    Note that I only wish to take the doxy -- with the aforementioned dosaged -- for 2 days. Then goodbye doxy.

    Main goal here is weight loss without exercise. My fitness trainer told me that 80% of a weight loss plan is what you put in, the remaining 20% depends on calorie expenditure.
     
  4. y4nn

    y4nn Newbie

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    im sorry to say green xenon but there isnt any otc sleep meds that will just knock you out, i know you want no exercise but seriously just put your trainers on and do some running trust me if weight loss is the goal running will sort that even hill sprints and interval work will get you tired than any otc med then you only need to keep hydrated and sleep just dont mong it on your runs and try not to stop say on a 6 to 8 mile run. Of course you can get codeine nod from co-codomol if the usa sell it just be careful of paracetemol content or what ever you guys call it over there.
     
  5. Green Xenon

    Green Xenon

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    I just took 125 mg of doxylamine succinate. Will anything bad happen?

    I'm thinking of doing the same tomorrow. Then, on Friday, I quit because I need to be awake for a social event that takes place on the evening of that day.
     
  6. Mersann

    Mersann About DF, German, Various Staff Member

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    125? And you didn't write anything wrong there?

    Wikipedia says that 6.25mg may be enough to induce sleep, even though more commonly preparations up to 25mg are used and this document: http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monographs/vol79/mono79-10.pdf says

    On the other hand, it also seems to be the case that the LD50 is pretty high. Still, I find this extremely reckless. Taking a high dosage of a drug, AFTERWARDS asking in an ONLINE FORUM whether anything bad will happen now. This isn't even your usual encounter around here, with people asking whether they might not be alright because they have some kinds of symptoms that might point to something abnormal going on.

    Wow, I don't even know why I googled that for you.

    //Edit:

    I also find your approach to losing weight really strange. You may have been told that not eating is a good way of losing weight, but I'm seriously not so sure whether that's a healthy approach. There may be totally valid reasons for fasting, but what you're doing there doesn't fit to any possible scenarios I have in mind.
     
  7. DriftAway

    DriftAway Titanium Member

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    The "sleep diet" will only make it harder for you to lose the existing weight you have. By sleeping and not eating your making you metabolism (what regulates and burns calories) run SLOWER on purpose. So any cardio that you may have done the day before was a total waste.
    So are you going to say that junk food and being lazy is too tempting to resist? There is no easy way to lose weight! I went from a 120 lb surfer/triathlete to a 200lb blob after I broke my back in a motorcycle accident....you know what? I got off the meds, started eating right with portion control and EXERCISING! It took me two years but now Im 130 lbs...so I lost 70 lb in two years I went from a size 15 to now Im a size 3. yes it was hard, yes I didn't want to exercise but being thin, happy and healthy was my motivation.

    Oh yea and my husband was trying to GAIN weight so I always had lots of treats and candy and snacks and it takes WILL POWER and sticking to your goals....its so worth it when you get where you want to be weight wise.

    Sorry to be rude but I hate people who are so lazy they cant even help themselves.

    So whats your current weight and your goals? Whats your job and diet like? I have family in Diamond Bar and Ive seen plenty of gyms there and the weather isn't too bad. Go hiking or skiing in Big Bear thats only like and hour and a half from you. There alot of good mountain biking and hiking in Diamond Bar too....Get outside!


    Sorry for the rant....Im a personal trainer and if you have questions about losing weight Im here to help.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2011
  8. staples

    staples Gold Member

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    This is an extremely unhealthy way of losing weight. People binge eat and then fast (without pharmacological help) before eating competitions--you believe using a drug to force a similar regimen will rid you of your appetite? It takes a while for the stomach to shrink (which seems to be the mechanism you believe will reduce your appetite).

    I don't mean to dissuade your weight-loss efforts, but you've devised this plan based on a fact given to you by your fitness trainer. It seems that before trying anything remotely like this, you should clarify with your fitness trainer that, based on his information, this could even work. I think he was talking about a longer-term regimen, not a 1-2 day deal...

    Or perhaps consult a general physician for some direction on the best course of action? There are appetite suppressants that won't make you lose days of your life! Also, using antihistamines as hypnotics increase stage 2 of sleep whereas you'd want to achieve prolonged deeper stages of sleep to influence your body's metabolism to use fat cells for energy, and in fact the whole reduced-calorie, low-intensity idea may cause muscle atrophy, especially with suppressed deep sleep stages. I believe (and I'm no expert, but I know some that I could probably get a hole of for you) a better approach would be anaerobic exercise with periodically increased calorie intake.

    Don't get me wrong, this forum is a great resource and I'm glad you've come here for advice, but really a forum cannot possibly have the resources to treat your specific case and what you want to do seems completely unheard of, so please consult at least your fitness trainer and/or suitable medical professional(s)!
     
  9. missparkles

    missparkles Platinum Member & Advisor

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    Listen love, forget all about OTC drugs and do this the healthy way. A successful weight loss plan is not one that will enable you to lose the most weight the fastest, it's one that can be incorporated into your day to day routine, enabling you to get down to your desired weight...and remain there.

    Sleeping for two days (that would need a sledgehammer, not an OTC antihistamine) will not shrink your stomach sufficiently to cause a loss of appetite. As has already been said, it will just push your body into a kinda "siege mode" slowing your metabolism down in it's attempt to retain calories. You'll also retain water, which will not only be unhealthy, it will also add to your weight.

    I can't understand how any qualified trainer would advise you to starve yourself to lose weight, because not only is it extremely unhealthy, it could also be quite dangerous. One of the healthiest ways you can lose weight with very little effort (as has already been said) is by eating smaller portions, taking the stairs rather than using the elevator, walk (where possible) rather than drive.

    But that does take time.

    Try taking some exercise maybe three to four times a week, you'll find that afterwards you'll have very little appetite. This is due to the bodies own natural opioid called endorphins. These will also make you feel good, raise your energy levels, and they have a positive effect on your mood too.

    But one thing that is really important...always consult a GP (doctor) just to make sure there are no underlying medical reasons why you've gained weight in the first place. Also check out that it's ok for you to exercise and diet, it might be necessary for you to avoid certain exercises. They'll also be able to advise you as to a healthy fitness/diet regime. One that will get you slim and more importantly, keep you that way.

    Take care and stay safe love.:)

    Sparkles.:vibes:
     
  10. 3pollard

    3pollard Newbie

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    As someone said before , eating less is probably going to make you to gain weight since your metabolism will go really slow and will try to store the maximum amount of energy (as fat) from anything you eat after that time away of food.

    Also real planned diets with medical assistance most of times makes the patient fell that he is eating even more than before since you start eating every 3 hours and eating a lot of fibers and protein to feel satisfied most of the time.

    rethink your approach , losing weight the healthy way is much better than it looks like , also don't think that exercises only matters because of the calories burned , their main function is to speed-up the metabolism and to release "pleasure hormones" (just like stims used in diets), not to burn calories which will be achieved by your own metabolism and a low but constant intake of calories.