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the MAOI’s thread

Discussion in 'Various drugs not covered by other forums' started by genaro, Jun 5, 2005.

  1. genaro

    genaro Iridium Member

    Reputation Points:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Ok, here are a few well known substances withMAOI properties:

    Peganum Harmala (syrian rue)& Banisteriopsis Caapi(contain harmine, harmaline andterahydroharmine: these arethree potent MAOI-A chemicalswhich also have hallucinogenic properties in high dose)...Probably the best plants one can use for making ayahuasca.

    Passifloraincarnata (passion flower) contains beta-carbolines (including some harmine), it is psychoactive but probably not hallucinogen (has an MAOI activity and acts as an antidepressor and relaxant). Oral dose (as a tea) for MAOI activity would have to be pretty high asthis plantisn't much concentrated: 250g dried plant at least (from a calculation I did make)...so achieving MAO inhibition by using passion flower would require great quantities, much better use peganum harmala seeds or banisteriopsis caapi vine.

    Yohimbe (contains yohimbine)...said to have some MAOI properties, but I don't think it would be safe to use for this purpose (as it also has some strong cardiovascular effects)

    Moclobemide (apharmaceutical MAOI-A)...has been used succesfully as an IMAO for ayahuasca preparation.

    And now, here are a few other ones I'mextremely curious about:




    Does any one have any infoabout these last three chemicals ? Any experiences with these ?

    How much of each do you need to achieve MAO inhibition ?(I belive doses to be pretty small, like a few milligrams)

    Would they only have MAOI properties or would they also have hallucinogenic effects in high dose (just like harmaline has) ?

    Edited by: genaro
  2. phenethylamine

    phenethylamine Newbie

    Reputation Points:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Some useful information regarding. Different harmala alkaloids vary in potency. The equivalent of 100 mg harmine is 50 mg harmaline, 35 mg tetrahydraharman, 25 mg harmalol or harmol, 4 mg methoxyharmalan. Harmal alkaloids are synergistic (mutually potentiating) and are therefore most effective when combined in an appropriate balance. Tropines (belladonna alkaloids) also potentiate harmals. Harmol and harmalol (phenols) in overdoses can cause progressive CNS paralysis.
  3. Eirias

    Eirias Gold Member

    Reputation Points:
    Jan 21, 2005
    I did fairly extensive research utilizing yohimbine HCl as a
    potential MAOI a few years back. Initially, I was really excited
    in that it seemed to work well with various phenethylamines, and being a
    stimulant rather than a sedative like harmine and harmaline, it had
    some advantages in that repect as well. However, In the end I was lead to
    conclude that it was either not an MAOI or that it only
    inhibited MAO-B enzymes, as it had no MAOI effects when used in
    correlation with tryptamines, as was verified via the bioassay of an ayhuasca-type brew using P. viridis as
    the DMT-contributing plant and yohimbine as the MAOI (a similar
    experiment was conducted with a DPT/yohimbine "propylhuasca", with
    similar conclusions/results as the Psychotria experiment). It was not an
    issue of too little DMT either, because once it was clear that the
    yohimbine wasn't working, we promptly consumed an active amount of pure
    harmaline HCl and were instantly thrust into a full +++ ayahuasca space
    within 15-20 min. (the same results occured when adding harmaline in
    this manner during the propylhuasca experiment as well).

    My conclusion is that 1) yohimbine is either exclusively an MAO-B inhibitor, or 2) </span>that it was seemingly potentiating the phenethylamines due to some other sort of subjective synergistic mechanism.

    Be careful when experimenting with yohimbine, as it raises blood pressure markedly.

    Furthermore, we found pure harmaline or harmine HCl to be a
    vastly superior MAOI material versus Syrian Rue, or any extract or
    concentrate thereof. It rarely produced any nausea, or the strong
    sedation that P. harmala concoctions did. A small "smear" (about
    ~15mg. on or under the tongue) of the pure material lowered MAO
    production significantly for a sufficient amount of time to conduct
    virtually any ayahuasca-type experiments. This lead us to
    conclude that the heavy body load and side-effects so often associated
    with MAOIs and ayahuasca experiments could readily be avoided, and were
    in no way "intrinsic" to the ayahuasca experience, as some people would
    lead you to believe (i.e. some folks suggest that the nausea, vomiting,
    diarrhea, and other side-effects are a sort of "cleansing" or "purging"
    and are thus a core part of the yaje experience in that respect).
    This concurs with J. Ott's thoughts on the issue as well.
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 26, 2009