Re: Modafinil thumbs up! well I think that 300mg is too much. in SWIms opinion modafinil doesnt really have any abusable value/recreational.. and should rather be looked at as an nootropic and not a speed substitute (which it is not!!)
I am starting to experiment with modafinil recently, I am very interested in this chemical and very satisfied with its effects. I would describe effects of 200 mg as complete and absolute alertness with remarkable clean side-effect profile. The stimulation is mental as well as physical, for SWIM reduces fatigue for 12+ hours and just removes all sings of tiredness. There is no comedown whatsoever, the only unwanted effects SWIM can tell is stomach discomfort, bowel movements, easy "discharge", appetite supresion and posible imsomnia if dosing late. However, most wean off or reduce the first week of use. A bit of tolerance is noted but not too much. I takes 200 mg in the morning, and this keeps him not tired for the rest of the day allowing him to sleep. I am really amazed with this and for its purpose and thinks its one of the most perfect drugs he is tried. Of course, I do not think one could get any sort of high with modafinil, there is no euphoric feelings, your emotional state does not change, and dosing too much I imagine would be a bad idea. I am sick of classic stimulats like ritalin and amphetamine cause they work for just 2 hours, SWIM can't deal with the edgyness and anxiety, the physical side effects and the push to redose, and SWIM can't even get high of them anymore. Please post experiences, I'm very interested in other people view.
Re: Modafinil thumbs up! Nootropics like -cetams don't have any effect on SWIM except for placebo maybe. Not stimulating at all. Modafinil stimulation is evident. I think modafinil is not a nootropic, just an stimulant, or maybe an anti-fatigue if that exists. Definitely helps concentration and completely kills somnolence. Modafinil deserves a definition on it's own cause it's perty unique. Those are of course, SWIM opinion. Read: not recreative. That can be good or bad, depends on what you looking for.
Swim only experienced psychological effects. He got into a stimulant loop. When taking them twice a day (200 mg) he couldn't sleep well, so he took gbl to sleep. This left him tired the next morning so he took modafinil again etc. Took one day of good sleeping to got out of this loop. He began to like the boosted focus, intellect and memory a bit too much, which gave some euphoria. But nothing too serious. Overall, use seems to be self limiting. Too high dosages (600 mg a day with tolerance) really makes me nervous and anxious. His use pattern seems to be more strategic than of the type constant abuse. It is addicting is swims opinion, but it doesn't give swim physical wd's.
How about benzos and modafinil? Would benzos counteract the alertness from the modafinil and maybe remove any anxiety?
I have a hard time believing that this has no negative effects. I felt a serious crash after my doses of it and while on it I found that it felt more unhealthy then when I've done amphetamines. It was surprisingly euphoric though which made the experience worth it, just not something I'd make a habit out of.
200mg-400mg I have trouble making himself study and thinks moda is great. he likes it for study sessions, however considers it bad for socializing. I am somewhat caffeine dependent and didn't find taking moda to reduce his need for caffeine. after pulling an all-nighter I found that even though he could stay awake, his mental functioning deteroriated and he experienced common sleep deprivation side effects such as paranoia and feeling out of it. I believe this stuff definitely has its limits, but it's great for what it is.
after trying moda & adra, I has to say they are VERY similar, hard to distinguish, yet Adra takes 1-2 hours to work, moda only 30 min. sometimes the body load with adra is a little higher, which can be positive as it makes one feel that he took sth and makes I use it even more for studying as he doesnt wanna waste it. as a medication he would prefer modafinil though, for studying, occasional use, adra is better, which is nevertheless mainly due to the hughe price difference
Modafinil (Provigil brand) - 2200mg - Experienced - He feels INCREDIBLE! Stats and Drug History: I am a 25-year-old male, weighs about 165 lbs (75 kg), and is 5' 11" tall. Dose: 2200mg Modafinil (Oral) Other drugs he is familiar with: amphetamines, propylhexedrine, bupropion (generic Wellbutrin), benzodiazepines, Vicodin (hydrocodone and paracetamol), and caffeine. He is currently taking bupropion daily (except for when planning this experiment) and clonazepam maybe once or twice a week as needed. He has taken doses of Modafinil as high as 1400mg before, but he had taken 300mg of Wellbutrin (Bupropion) the same day, and he thinks that this would have blunted any pleasant effects he would have felt at the time. He has not taken a dose of Bupropion for around 2 days, his last dose being 150mg the day before yesterday. Research: His interest in experimenting with his Modafinil was inspired by this thread; https://drugs-forum.com/threads/31379, as well as this report titled "In Higher Doses" which he came across on another site; "After being prescribed Provigil, I found it to often be everything that drugs like Ritalin and Adderal claimed to be. At an initial dose of 200mg, I didn't really feel much of a change from the initial SSRI/amphetamine combo I was smoothing out. While suppressing my appetite a bit I still felt as prone to have sleepy moments during the day, although I felt more alert when wakeful. My doctor recommended trying as many as 3 or 4 tablets (600-800mg), early in the morning to attempt to prevent those sleepier moments from kicking in. I didn't notice much of a change until I hit 800mg. During the day I would get periods of moderate euphoria and a very intense 'good' feeling, I would often smile deeply. The world seemed to quiet down and flatten somewhat. However, after a time, this feeling stopped coming as easily, and I had to keep upping the dose to get it back, until I hit the 1000mg mark, and decided to keep it down a little more. " I have not taken any other substances today (except for eating a bowl of cereal about an hour before dosing. Swim skipped his usual coffee so that this report wouldn't be effected.) Before taking the pills, he was feeling pretty bored and relatively blah, but interested in the experiment. He decided on a very large dose, he knows, don't try this at home! After reading a few studies reporting that up to 4 grams of Modafinil have been taken, as well as doses around 2000mg for many days in a row, without any dangerous effects, he wasn't too worried, he has no previous issues with his heart or anything like that. He also seems to have extremely high natural tolerance for most substances, even without using them often. It's a shame, really. Experience The setting is his living room, relaxed because he didn't have to go into the office today. At about 9 AM, he took 7 of the 200mg pills to test it out. He is alone, his boyfriend is at work, so he can't attest to the enhanced social feelings at this dose, although on a normal dose of 200mg he usually does feel more chatty. A half hour to 45 minutes after taking 1400mg, I felt reaaaaally good. Like REALLY good. He was happy that his theory was confirmed, and it most likely was the Bupropion that blocked the effects the other reporters experienced. At around the 45 minute mark, he took another 4 pills of Provigil, bumping his dose up to 2200mg. It is now a little after 12pm, about 3 hours into the experience, and I have been feeling waves of giddy euphoria since he began to come up on the modafinil. He doesn't feel particularly motivated to do things that he should do, like clean or organize things for work. He DOES feel pleasantly stimulated and motivated to write this report and to do other things he enjoys. He is having a very easy time concentrating, researching, and writing. For instance, he is very curious as to why Modafinil is always capitalized on Wikipedia, but propylhexedrine is not... is it because Modafinil isn't a precise chemical name? Anyway, it's unusually pleasurable to find information and write this report. He doesn't feel overstimulated at all, it's almost as though he has taken caffeine with a large dose of Bali Kratom, except he isn't experiencing the nausea he would usually feel at a dose of Kratom high enough to get this much pleasure. It is reminding him of Vicodin that he was prescribed once after a football injury. It's very much like a strong opiate high, but without the drowsiness. It's not at all like I would expect cocaine (which he hasn't had the cojones to try yet) or similar stimulants to be, because he feels more methodical than manic. He is overall very relaxed and happy, with waves of euphoria and tingly feelings coming over him every few seconds, or whenever he concentrates on his body's sensations. He is feeling tingly in his... private regions, as well? Interesting. Very interesting. :laugh: He could go on and on about how he feels, but I think that would be less to do with accuracy and more to do with the Modafinil increasing his desire to keep writing. Side effects: He feels flushed and warm, but he didn't appear unusually red when he looked in the mirror. His heart rate is up, even though he feels relaxed, which is an odd sensation. His pupils are dilated a bit. I have had anxiety problems in the past, so he thought he might get this side effect, but he is feeling calm and relaxed, with no desire to turn to his trusty Klonopin (clonazepam) at all. He feels compelled to go to the Wiki pages of all the medicines he has stated while writing this, to see if he's spelling/capitalizing them properly. In summary, the way he feels is amazing. He can't really say that he recommends taking doses of Modafinil as high as he has, however. Provigil is very expensive, for one thing, and the addiction potential is high at this level. He is unaware of any solid findings on damage done to the body at doses this high, as most of the literature says it isn't dangerous. This means nothing, however, since there have been few studies done of this dose long term. (Swim thinks the longest study he found of high doses of Modafinil was 20-some days at around 2g? Larger doses of around 4g only documented in two people, it seems.) Anyway, swim obviously can't take Modafinil at these doses often, or he'd blow through the pills very quickly, and as he stated, Provigils are very pricey. It has been a worthwhile experiment and experience for him, however, especially if the euphoria lasts as long as the previous reports imply that it might. He advises that You shouldn't bother doing this if they are taking Wellbutrin/Zyban/bupropion or similar medicine, since if they react as he did to the combination, you'll end up very awake for many many hours and feeling no euphoria at all. He can also see how this doses from 1000mg-2200mg could cause one to have a panic attack. His heart is beating quickly; the peripheral effects aren't bad for swim, but someone prone to anxiety or who has a heart condition may have a very different reaction to the experience. He feels good, but it is obvious to swim that this is an addictive substance for him. It's expensive and who knows what it might do to people with certain medical conditions. Don't try this at home. I know he wont be able to get away with this too many times, and doesn't want to feel responsible for swiy's face showing up on 'Intervention' or the local news, either. His friend IMed him while he was editing this (Obsessively editing this, he might say), so he will stop raving endlessly here and move to a more conversational mode of expressing his excitement. Talking to other people is a lot of fun right now, though. :laugh: I started this at noon and here, it's almost 1:30 PM! Increased focus, indeed! Thanks for reading my friend's report! -TC
LOL. Wow. Huge doses. But, now SWIM's kitty definitely wants to give this one a go. She has an appt with her neuro Saturday now. The Amantadine she got a few months ago during her last visit did zippo for that MS "afternoon-fatigue" blahs. This sounds like just the ticket to pick her up when she needs it as well as being a substance that can occasionally be enjoyed recreationally as well. Thanks for the experience post SwiTCh
Hmm, SWIM also noticed that bupropion messes with how she feels modafinil work. Taking a week-and-a-half's worth of medication is going to cause SOME psychoactive effect, obviously lol, but I am curious what a dose that high might do with hormonal birth control, since modafinil has been shown to interfere with it. Not that SWI-ThC (heh, ThC) would need to know about that lol, but SWIM might look into that. StarryEyedNoOne added 7 Minutes and 45 Seconds later... Well, Erowid says "The prescribing information for Modafinil products clearly states there is an interaction with hormonal contraceptives, but provides no information about how this is known. The mechanism is that Modafinil upregulates (increases effectiveness of) the enzyme CYP3A4/5, which is involved in the metabolism of the contraceptive hormones and thus breaks them down more quickly. We have only been able to find a single paper that looked at the issue in humans and it showed that daily 400mg doses of Modafinil for a month significantly reduced the levels of the hormone estradiol and norgestimate in the 16 women studied. There is no direct research showing actual increases in impregnation rates and it is unclear whether less frequent or lower doses of Modafinil would have clinically significant effects on hormonal birth control. Some physicians have recommended increased doses of birth control as a solution." Does anyone think that a one-time, very high dose of modafinil would cause a significant issue with BC? It kind of seems by this study it would have to be long-term usage.
swim also should say that taking a dose as high as he did in his report shouldn't be necessary to get good effects. I has read that doses of 800mg have been reported as euphoric, and he originally was feeling good at 1400mg, but he decided to push it. You don't necessarily have to blow through 11 days' meds, cause as he keeps repeating (because it's very very true, at least for swim) this stuff is pricey! no idea on the bc, but there are some good studies cited at modafinilDOTcom.
I am a 75kg male. On the day preceding this experience I went to bed at 11.00PM, but really struggled to get to sleep, and the sleep he did get was of a very low quality. 6.50AM – SWIM’s alarm wakes him up. He is incredibly tired. 7.50AM – 200mg of modafinil was taken orally, shortly after breakfast cereal was eaten. 16.5 hours earlier 150mg of pregabalin was taken. 8.20AM – Alertness gradually increases up to this point. Whenever SWIM turns his head he can feel himself mentally taking in all of the new information. There is no euphoria, but I feel good. 8.35AM – SWIM sends a text message and seems to do so very speedily and efficiently. He listens to music, and in his mind he is always one step ahead of the lyrics. He is able to pay attention to other people and things at the same time as listening to the music, much better than he would usually be able to. 9.10AM – I do some work, he is incredibly productive. When I am focused on doing something time seems to go by very fast. I am very witty, and dominates all of the conversations that he has. SWIM notices that while he is very awake and alert, this doesn’t prevent him from having the odd moment of stupidity. 11AM – I have an in depth conversation with his friend, who also took 200mg of modafinil at 8AM as well as another 200mg at 5PM the day before. SWIM’s friend also had a poor nights sleep (very usual for him). The conversation was quite intense, and moved forward at a rapid pace. 12.40PM – I get a moderate headache that lasts for five minutes. This is the only side effect he has felt so far, and it is identical to the headaches that he sometimes gets while using more traditional stimulants (caffeine and low dose amphetamine). 1PM – SWIM yawns, though he still feels very alert (though not quite to the extent that he did earlier). 2PM – SWIM yawns a few times, though again he still feels alert. He occasionally feels like he should be tired, but that the modafinil is preventing this. I am very impressed with the alertness and productivity, because he usually copes very poorly without sleep and often has a nap at around this time (he always gets oddly tired in the afternoons). 2.30PM – SWIM writes part of an experience report. This is very easy; I have no problem deciding upon the words that he wants to use or remembering the times at which certain things occurred, and he makes very few spelling mistakes. 5.40PM – I think that his level of alertness has definitely decreased, but he doesn’t feel tired. 6.15PM – SWIM still feels awake, but at the same time he has an aspect of tiredness that tells him he needs to sleep. He goes to bed and sets his alarm for 20 minutes into the future. He didn’t really sleep, though it is possible he could have got up to 5 minutes, and when the alarm went off I was wide awake again. Brief naps like this are a known to help with excessive daytime sleepiness (SWIM often does this), but the fact that such a small amount of sleep was able to cause such a state of wakefulness is fascinating. 7PM – SWIM attends kickboxing training. He performed well, but any possible improvement was not significant enough to be linked to the modafinil. 11.30PM – No more noticeable tiredness is noted up to this point, but that matches SWIM’s ruined sleeping pattern (although I felt tired early on the two previous nights, one of those nights followed the dose of pregabalin); recently I have been having to force himself to go to bed between midnight and 1AM, and I was exercising heavily only 2.5 hours previously which usually makes him less tired. I go to bed. It takes him a while to get to sleep, but when he does he sleeps well. 6.30AM (the following day) – SWIM wakes up of his own accord 20 minutes before his alarm was due to wake him, which is very unusual. I feel tired at the lack of sleep, but less so than he would expect. To briefly conclude, this isn’t a wonder drug for boosting intelligence at this dosage, but it did exactly what SWIM expected to an impressive level. I feel that using this occasionally could benefit him greatly.
Substance: Modafinil Body weight and gender: Male, 80kg (forties) Dosage: 1 x 100mg oral Duration: 1 day Onset: 1hr full stomach Plateau: 2 hours Aftereffects: 6 hours. Effects: wakefulness more focus Settings: work - meetings driving Side effects: none Hangover: extra sleepy in evening I am interested in staying alert during the day and wants to sleep well at night so is not interested in trying to stay awake for long periods of time. I am an healthy adult male who weighs 80Kg is not taking any other medicines. I am high functioning but meets the DSM-IV criteria for ADD. I had flown in from another city the night before. I tried 100mg (half therapeutic dose) generic modafinil at 8am after reading up on the datasheets so was aware of uncommon and common side effects. SWIM generally takes a couple of hours to wake up and get moving in the morning. At 9am I was aware of being more awake than usual but not definitely not jittery, no mood elevation and no sense of being bursting with energy or high. I felt focussed and was aware of doing things with more care. During morning discussion didn't notice any improvement in ability to articulate thoughts (usually terrible in the morning) but more reflective and focussed. I felt that at any point during the day he could have rested and gone to sleep but noticed he could just go on without strugggling. SWIM noticed his appetite was suppressed throughout the day. I am usually racing against the clock and does time sensitive work but didn't feel irritable or stressed. SWIM noticed no variation throughout the day until 20:00 when SWIM began to feel more tired than usual (as if the day had caught up with him). SWIM noticed that the safety profile of Modafinil is pretty good and plans to try a 200mg dose soon.
Re: Modafinil experiences (pt 2) I had aday clear of Modafinil before trying 200mg dose - very much the same experience as on 100mg. I was spending the day cutting planks to tolerances withing a milimeter or so using a power saw. I had aproductive day and was largely error free for aboout six hours. About 20:00 a very noticable crash and I was very whacked out. Again appetite was supressed. Interestingly when I had aconversation with SWIM's nootropically and pharmacologically inclined Orang Utan the Orang Utan noticed a moderate jump in libido and reflected on potentiation of regional DA circuits - hmmmm. On reflection modafinil not a bad choice if I want to stay awake and busy. Neither SWIM or the talking Orang Utan wants to have a higher dose and will leave that sort of thing to others.
Re: Modafinil experiences (pt3) SWIM gave modafinil at rest for a week and tried 100mg as a pick me up in the middle of the day. I was in a bad mood and after a couple of hours became focussed settled and all of the crapness seemed to drift away and I was able to concentrate in a nice energy band. SWIM noticed the energy crash on the two earlier experiences didn't happen on the later dose so thinks that for SWIM there is about nine or ten hours before the energy all leaks away.
OK, I would say that this belongs here: Just over a year ago, I went to the doctor's complaining of excessive tiredness. No matter how much sleep he got at night, he would get tired in the afternoon and need to take a nap. Forcing himself not to nap for extended periods of time to try and change his sleeping pattern didn't help - he just got even more tired. The doctor pretty much sent SWIM away straight away, because he recently had a lot of blood tests for another reason that all said I was healthy and had no reason to be tired. I was desperate, and went back the next week to see a different doctor at the same surgery. He knew that I had been to see another doctor for the same reason, and this annoyed him untill SWIM complained at how quickly he had been dismissed before. The new doctor went through the motions of some basic tests (got out his stethoscope etc.), then sent SWIM on his way with out a solution to his problem. SWIM's tiredness continued, and he ordered some modafinil for himself. He took his first dose around the 20th of April (the experience report a few posts up). The modafinil improved SWIM's situation greatly - with adequate sleep at night I found that only 50mg was enough to prevent him needing to nap in the afternoon, and I had gained a level of control that he hadn't had for some time. As stated, quite often he only took 50mg (a quarter of one of his tablets), and he didn't have it every day, though SWIM liked the security of being able to control his unnatural tiredness should the need arise. On the 14th of may, SWIM woke up several hours before his alarm was supposed to wake him. There was an intense itching all over his back, worse than a fiber glass itch. His back was very red, and covered in raised white bumps. A shower and an antihistamine (10mg cetirizine) seemed to help, though the cetirizine made SWIM drowsy, which is obviously something that he hates. A couple of days later the rash came back, and it kept on coming, to his back, neck, chest, shoulders and arms. Some rashes were only mild, but some were almost as intense as the first and covered huge areas. It is now the 26th of May, and the problem continues, while I am struggling to get a doctors appointment. SWIM can't say for sure that modafinil is causing this, but it's the only new thing in his life, adverse reactions to modafinil seem comparatively common, and there is the possibility of life-threatening skin conditions. This isn't intended to be a lecture, more of an overview of SWIM's experiences with modafinil (culminating in his allergic reaction), and a reminder to be careful. Sorry in advance, but here is a picture of one of SWIM's rashes. Often they were redder than this, they could cover most of SWIM's back and shoulders, and there could be vast amounts of the raised white blotches:
That looks like a horrible rash and SWIM sends You waves of concern. SWIM can be a bit rashy too and has noticed that with Modafinil there is skin sensitivity ( a bit like being out in the sun just a little too long) - but nothing as dramatic as this and it does not seem to escalate. When I have been under extreme stress - deaths, divorces, sorting everyone elses lives out with f-all support SWIM can develop angioedema very easily (yoga and almond croissants triggered the last one) - but resolved with rest and an Rx oral corticosteroids. SWIM hopes youS physician can help and suggests that an emergency appointment or emergency room attendance is a good way to go with severe rashes. Seriously You shouldnt wait for this to resolve itself and have it looked at. On the positive side SWIM noticed that he had great skin on the resolution of his last rash - so maybe You will look young and beautiful at the end of all of this. SWIM tries to make a habit of using a very small amount of any novel substance in the cheek for a while to establish hypersensitivity and then using as You did escalating doses.
