Drug information Methylenedioxypyrovalerone (MDPV) Drug Info

Re: Mdpv

Nagognog2 - I have noticed the following effects with MDPV - stimulation, acidic stomach, decreased balance (a>5mg), and a brightening of the visual field like a very low dose of a psychedelic. I was watching a streetlight through a window and the rays of light reflecting off the glass were really beautiful. SWIM almost wondered if SWIM dosed a psych by mistake. Other effects include some mental dulling, though this is difficult to quantify due to other mental dulling agents (ie - weed) coadministered. Relatively rapid onset orally with alert at 30 min, peak at around 60-90- min, and overall a pretty short duration of effect. There is a 'fiend' factor, though I have found redosing relatively easy to resist. Not euphoria, even with an 8 mg dose. Also, this material seems to have a strong tolerance potential. I had the same experience as Nicaine the first time with a low dose and was mildly stimulated and awake about 12 hours. This has not proven to be the case subsequently. Also, in the dosage range used so far (< 10mg), no increased heart rate or blood pressure. Though it makes me a little unsteady and foggy-headed, it is a good motivator for getting work done. It also seems to facilitate social activity and make SWIM talkative. Lastly, it seems to consistently make SWIM feel a bit weird, like I am about to get sick, but so far this feeling has not evolved into full-blown malaise.. Also, it seems to help trigger panic attacks. I am not especially prone to them, but felt mild ones come on a few times, particularly in combination with other kratom and cannabis. However, this may be just SWIM as I was super-stressed at the time. No panic attacks at all with a recent 5 and 8 mg trial. I have tried oral, insufflation and smoked routes, and likes oral the best. If taken uncapped mixed in a beverage, the onset is rapid and overall it lasts longer. When smoking the effects are too short acting and it does seem to lead to more compulsive use (big surprise!).

 

Re: Mdpv

Everyone may have a different definition of euphoria. SWIM definitely notices the dopamine reuptake inhibition, which (in the case of any substance) often kicks off looking at porn and/or sex with a partner for him, therefore indirect euphoria which remains with him quite awhile afterward. There's also the pleasure of deep involvement in an activity or activities, to the exclusion of any/everything representing unhappiness.

True that it doesn't seem to have a direct euphoria of its own like opiates or high dose M1 (at least the first d@mn time a person uses it, SWIM never did quite recapture that). But neither is it lacking in pleasure the way 500mg of caffeine tablets would be.

Being something of a self-proclaimed expert on dopamine boosting (hahah), I think it may just be you's brain telling him to back down for a couple-three weeks. Dopamine is neither endlessly available nor 'free' in the biochemical sense, and in SWIM's experience things can get really ugly when too much water is drawn from the well (e.g. smoking the stuff might not be any better of an idea than smoking crack). But I could be wrong, maybe there's something particularly toxic about the substance itself. If I sound like I'm lecturing, please b*tch at me...

 

Preliminary finding on length of effects...

This is still preliminary, but I found his first dose today of around 5mg to last less than three hours, and a subsequent redose (similar amount) to still be going strong at 4.5 hours. This suggests to SWIM that one redose may be important to maximize the effects of the substance, provided that a fleeting high isn't desired (e.g. for a single sexual encounter followed by sleep). There's certainly a depression associated with coming down the first time, in part due to just feeling cheated because of the brevity of the high.

 

Addictive? Doubt it...

SWIM semi-agrees with this. MDPV is downright frustrating and maddening in its half-assed delivery of the goods. Both in terms of length and quality of effects (dopamine alone doesn't seem to cut it when one is lacking in sleep, norepinephrine reuptake inhibition is needed too). The depression/letdown when it wears off is bad precisely because one is left unsatisfied and unfulfilled.

I was thinking it would be extremely addictive at first (particularly given the low cost and ease of use) but now he's thinking a substance that tantalizes with half-realized glimpses and unkept promises has little chance of long-term intensive use. If it were purely utilitarian or purely fun I would find reasons to abuse the stuff, but ISHO it's not really very effective for either purpose. Maybe his opinion about it will change, who knows. Maybe he'll find some magical pairing with another stimulant. Anything's possible.

P.S. on the brighter (?) side I don't seem prone to "panic attacks" with redosing, although he's made sure to spread it out time-wise instead of dropping a load of the sh*t on his brain/body at once. It keeps him awake better than caffeine when sleep-deprived, but the difference is neither dramatic nor lasting. The combination of caffeine and MDPV is much better than MDPV alone for staying awake.

 

Re: MDPV Frequent Use

Eegads... this happened to SWIM for the first time tonight, completely out of the blue (i.e. not immediately after a redose). He thinks it may be related to a combination of factors such as caffeine use, kratom use and a dose of L-Tyrosine earlier today.

It really is bad enough to want to throw away the rest of the stuff and never touch it again. It doesn't feel like a "normal" panic attack with certain thoughts connected, it feels like a physiological reaction that builds and builds and builds. I am going to hit the benzos, despite concerns of respiratory depression in combination with other meds (the symptoms really give a person no choice at all).

I am going on a prolonged sabbatical from all recreational substances .

 

Re: Mdpv

Well, maybe it isn't the weed after all. SWIM can corroborate that the panic attacks are a distinct flavor from any I have experienced before. Either way, they are really bad when they happen, and seem unpredictable.
SWIM occasionally got panic attacks from kratom alone, and moreso in combo with MDPV. However, I have avoided these by keeping the dose low. L-tyrosine has always given SWIM tachycardia and in larger doses, tremors (SWIM like dlpa better - smoother and same endpoint), so it probalby didn't help. A little phenibut seems to help smooth out this aspect of MDPV. I bet it would be really good with a little GBL mixed in. Used to stop my panic attacks dead in their tracks and took the prosexual effects of stimulants through the roof. Too bad that one's long gone....
Good luck with the sabbatical, Nicaine....

 

Re: Mdpv

Does You have access to prescription meds, through a doctor or otherwise? Try and get a small supply of labetalol, SWIM informs me it really helps with MDPV-style panic attacks. Even more than benzos. It's the only beta blocker that also has some alpha-adrenergic blocking capability, which helps stop that panicky feeling without a tranquilizing effect.

SWIM wishes he had access to GBL, but it seems really difficult to get in the USA (and quite a risk, significant quantities of fluid sent through the mail can be pretty noticeable). SWIM really has things he needs more though, he got paid today and ordered some xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx WARNING TIME, Speedy!both of which he really needs in his harm reduction arsenal.

 

Re: Mdpv

I use atenolol for panic attacks which seems to work well, but makes me feel really sluggish afterwards.
Check response on the GBL and phenibut threads you started..

Also, what does yous monkeys use to atomize materials. Is it an afrin nasal inhaler or something fancy ?

 

Re: Mdpv

Did SWIM actually post sources he ordered from in message #110? He remembers mentioning getting some protein powder and electrolyte tablets, but I guess he didn't think linking to huge web retailers like bodybuilding suppliers and health food stores to be a violation of the rules (guess he was wrong ). He's gotta cut back on the benzos and ambien, it's making him flaky.

An observation on MDPV, btw... SWIM never encountered another stimulant that feels so good after a decent night's sleep, and so BAD when one was previously up all night. Most stimulants improve sleep deprivation to one extent or another, MDPV make the situation worse. It's the wrong choice for staying up extended hours.

There are many OTC nasal products out now with pump atomizers... take a look-see around a local drugstore. The bottle should say "metered pump spray" on it.

 

Re: Mdpv

I have really been feeling like sh*t today... physically weak/drained, general malaise, random "headrushes" and brain fog. He suspects he's malnourished. Something is wrong with his digestive system... dull upper left quadrant pain that comes and goes (ulcer?), plus general stomach and intestinal discomfort. He also feels depressed/anxious. He's not sure if this is due to MDPV use, or having *not* used any MDPV today. In any case, he thinks MDPV use plays a major role in whatever the current condition of his health, although he's also been over-using Ambien and is basically addicted to it.

 

Re: Mdpv

MDPV seemed to mess with my digestive system as well with stomach cramps and other disturbances. I think that You has really stressed out yous lab monkeys. I think that if You thinks that yous monkeys have ulcers, that they should start taking zantac or prilosec asap, eat regular bland well balanced diets (lay off the bananas!), and that the monkeys be provided with a comfy bed to sleep in (a lot). Continue tyrosine supplments, and a good strong antioxidant like lycopene or ALA would be a good idea. It is good to always take strong antioxidants and milk thistle, as well as an acid blocker in tandem with any stimulant run. They help counteract a lot of the damage stimulants do. SWIM's monkeys used to get the same symptoms from heavy speed binges when they escaped from the lab and raised hell. A monkey can only take so much physical stress.
Good luck and stick with that black tea thing for a while. No probing the monkeys - let them rest...

 

Re: Mdpv

Already done... Zantac's sitting on top of the fridge, along with a bottle of Pepto Bismol. Diet's improving, and will basically take care of itself if SWIM's monkeys lay off for awhile.

That could get complicated, with their Ambien running out... but we'll see.

I like EGCg, although he doesn't feed it to his monkeys as often as he should.

Thanks... will do.

P.S. things have improved as the day has gone on... I was pretty close to calling a doctor, but changed his mind.

 

Re: Mdpv

I am starting to think even one use of MDPV depletes dopamine enough to cause mild depression (the fiending is a good sign of that), and usage over a course of days seems capable of causing severe depression. Does anyone concur, based on their experiences with the stuff?

It's really too bad how this stuff has such a narrow "therapeutic" index, i.e. quite a fine line between a good high and essentially an O.D. It really takes on a rough edge at higher doses, and although this is only conjecture it seems to hit norepinephrine receptors once dopamine reuptake is saturated (thus the infamous MDPV panic attacks). Strange too how the stuff lingers in the body, or is it just that it alters brain chemistry enough so it merely seems to? Quite an interesting substance, but frankly one that SWIM wishes he had never discovered. Oh well... (shrug).

 

Re: Mdpv

SWIM made up a second batch of dilute MDPV to assay and has been pushing the monkeys hard.
I do not concur about depression as I feel pretty normal the next day. Though SWIM tends to be somewhat depressed to begin with, it does not seem worse.
I do concur on the narrow therpeutic index, but experiments with combinations are pending which will hopefully broaden MDPVs effects.
I enjoyed 7 mg MDPV in combination with 5 mg 5meoMIPT, 6 g kratom, and then smoked DPT later during peak effects (~20mg). All doses were low, but the combination was enjoyable and SWIM's monkeys did not fiend later in the night. There was of course a psychedelic edge, but it brought the overall effects closer to those of methylone. DPT and 5meoMIPT in lower doses have predominantly stimulant and somatic sensory effects for SWIM. These really fleshed out the pure dopamine of the MDPV.
How is it that MDPV lingers, Nicaine? Are you referring to your monkey's depression, or other residual effects ? Depression is a common problem after any drug which depletes serotonin or dopamine, and I find that depressive episodes can be intense a day or two after a psychedelic or stimulant. It is worse in those already predisposed to depression like SWIM's monkeys. SWIM's monkeys are depressed to some extent all the time and refuse to go back on SSRIs because they will ruin any recreational potential with mymonkey's favorite substances and are dangerous drugs to boot. SWIM's monkeys manage okay without them, and deals with their depression by brooding in sidewalk cafes, quietly berating the establishment in a French accent, and refusing to deliver fedex packages....

SWIM splits the MDPV into sequential doses an hour apart, which prevents that anxiety/tachycardia which I get from smoking, snorting, eating a large dose at once or redosing a past target dosage. SWIM split 7 mg/2hours.

 

Re: Mdpv

LOL... that was worth a grin or two . Ditto for SWIM's monkeys too re: depression, although he would really prefer it not be the case, and will seriously consider dumping all chemical substances & selling his monkeys off to a nice little old lady if it continues too long or becomes overwhelming. I am pretty sick of the direction his life's been headed since about '04 (errm, like 1904 ) and thinks he may actually be on the verge of being fed up enough to go through with it. He feels the same about SSRI's, but has a script for bupropion and could start on that again...

As far as MDPV lingering, it's mostly from repeated rectal dosing, which both introduces a lot of drug and often delays absorption. You can probably guess the results -- a very prolonged, lingering high! I am not going to use this route of admin with MDPV again, as it's just too unpredictable and can become extremely unpleasant. He's pretty satisfied with intranasal use... although it's still easy to keep redosing, at least things die down within a reasonable time frame once the redosing stops.

BTW, I like the combo of Phenibut and MDPV a lot... tests on his monkeys today show that it takes much of the edge off MDPV, while causing neither drowsiness nor sedation. If You is looking for something like that, give it a try (four tablets of "MRM Relax-All" were fed to his lab animals two hours prior).

P.S. - writing this really got SWIM thinking... maybe he'll use what's left of his MDPV & then seriously consider whether to just put his monkeys on Wellbutrin and see how that works out. It would be easy enough to take them off again & resume experimentation with RC's... hmmm. Perhaps an extended break would not be a bad idea at this point.

 

Re: Mdpv

Yes, I have also found phenibut to compliment MDPV nicely - in some ways, it makes it a more useful substance for SWIM now.
Always a good idea to abstain if that is what you need to do, or at least try, to change your life. However, remember that drugs are just a symptom of something deeper inside which drives the abuse. Anti-depressants serve the same function, but without the high or stigma.
I have also fought getting back on antidepressants. I have only now considered it since GHB disappeared, since it served that purpose for SWIM quite nicely (better than SSRIs), as well as regulating my sleep and generally keeping SWIM productive. Now I only have crappy substitutes. SWIM hopes one day to maybe get a sodium oxybate RX, but sounds tough to acquire.
Wellbutrin did nothing for SWIM, BTW. As far as SSRIs, prozac seems safest and most effective, Paxil and venflaxine worst and most damaging/addictive. Wellbutrin would be the logical choice for you, however, due to self-admitted dopamine tweaking.
I have found oral best dosing for SWIM, and is actually starting to like the substance in a one time low dose. On that level, it is nice. I remember when 5meo DIPT became popular and everyone hated it because of bodyload. SWIM loved it as long as the dose stayed low. At that level, it was fantastic. MDPV is ruined with high dosing, and somewhere between 3-10mg seems to be the best level depending on individual sensitivity and tolerance (which is pretty strong..).

 

Re: Mdpv

I feel his curiosity is coming close to getting the better of him regarding MDPV. He's not into putting drugs in his nose, and unimpressed with reports of oral dosing so he is wondering: what might be a reasonable first-time rectal dose with MDPV? 5mg? Or might that be too much?

 

Re: Mdpv

4-5 mg sounds reasonable. That's the range I have tested rectal use with MDPV, and none of the unwanted over-stimulated peripheral effects was manifest.

 

Re: Mdpv

I would go with 1mg, wait an hour to make sure he didn't break out in hives, then do 4mg or 5mg. But he is sometimes overly cautious about that sort of thing. The dosage itself strikes him as highly unlikely to be too much, unless You were ill with kidney or liver complications, or weighed less than 100 U.S. Lbs or so.

 

Re: Mdpv

You do realize that this is rectal dose right? And its a first time dose, so swiradiometer doesn't know how his body will work with this substance, whether it will be sensitive or tolerant, etc.

You can't be overly cautious with first time rectal use of fairly novel stimulant research chemicals. Period.